Amtrak Management issues

[Amtrak25]

Foamers hate the Siemens trains, they would prefer an ancient set of Budd cars hauled by an E unit or F40.

Uncalled for sarcasm, obviously revealing of management's attitude. Passengers do not like being delayed 2 or 3 hours missing their connections, meetings, and appointments because Amtrak and Siemens can't figure out how to make their engines work after 7 years, reminiscent of Amtrak's E8's in the late 1970's.

 

[Brian Battuello]

Preferably with domes...

 

[user 14106]

Foamers hate the Siemens trains, they would prefer an ancient set of Budd cars hauled by an E unit or F40.

While you are likely correct, I do think some inquiry on the newer equipment is justified to ensure they are doing everything they can to improve reliability. I do also think they need to be better than 30,000 MMBSI - though I suspect that is the goal. However in the one year there was a significant improvement.

 

[user 14106]

This was released on Amtrak's performance incentive program (IE Bonuses) https://www.amtrak.com/content/dam/...corporate/2024-Amtrak-CDA-Briefing-061224.pdf . It was promised after the congressional hearing the other day.

 

[TransitTyrant]

While you are likely correct, I do think some inquiry on the newer equipment is justified to ensure they are doing everything they can to improve reliability. I do also think they need to be better than 30,000 MMBSI - though I suspect that is the goal. However in the one year there was a significant improvement.

That’s the only point I’m trying to make, things are improving.

 

[cirdan]

I am not sure the average rider, as opposed to many on AU, including you, who by all measure would fall in the category of various levels of foamership. What they care about is how often the train is on time and when late, how late at both origination and destination points of their journey. Heck, given the excellent knowledge of geography among the public many probably wouldn't even know what to make of an train originating station information even if provided one.

If Google Maps is better at finding connections than Amtrak's own website is, then I think something is amiss that does not just concern foamers.

 

[goganar]

I'm always intrigued by discussions around quasi-private / public entities in the context of profitability. Taxpayers paid for the infrastructure used by USPS, Amtrak equipment, just like they paid for the infrastructure of highways, bridges, roads, emergency service providers, etc. These institutions are an important part of our historical and future national identity.

We expect these service providers to continue to improve the quality of their services while appropriately managing their costs. We don't, however, expect the highway department or the fire department to turn a profit.

If Google Maps is better at finding connections than Amtrak's own website is, then I think something is amiss that does not just concern foamers.

If this is true about Google Maps accuracy, then, maybe Amtrak should throw out whatever system they are using and incorporate Google Maps into their system. Lots of other folks do just that.

 

[TransitTyrant]

Uncalled for sarcasm, obviously revealing of management's attitude. Passengers do not like being delayed 2 or 3 hours missing their connections, meetings, and appointments because Amtrak and Siemens can't figure out how to make their engines work after 7 years, reminiscent of Amtrak's E8's in the late 1970's.

That also doesn’t happen often, even with the corridor equipment.

 

[jis]

If Google Maps is better at finding connections than Amtrak's own website is, then I think something is amiss that does not just concern foamers.

Actually AFAICT it takes a super foamer to get almost anything done on the abomination that is the present Amtrak site

Does Google Maps let you reserve and book train tickets? I was not aware of that.

 

[cirdan]

Does Google Maps let you reserve and book train tickets? I was not aware of that.

Google provides a link, which unfortunately takes you back to the Amtrak landing page rather than direct to the booking for that particular train. But yeah, it's a start. There are always two steps to booking a journey, (1) working out what you want to do and (2) booking it. Amtrak's own website is not particularly supportive of (1) which is maybe why many non foamers never get to (2)

 

[zephyr17]

If Google Maps is better at finding connections than Amtrak's own website is, then I think something is amiss that does not just concern foamers.

Google Maps generally is dependent on the GTFS feed from the carrier, in this case Amtrak, though it will mix and match with other carriers, like Greyhound. I just checked and the current issues with Builder/Lake Shore Limited connections show in Google Maps, they are just as messed up as they currently are on Amtrak.com itself. Although Google Maps does show Greyhound connections from Albany that Amtrak itself would not.

Amtrak.com linking with Google Maps would just show the same connections as Amtrak.com does itself already, it isn't "finding connections".

Google Maps isn't magic. It uses an API exposing Amtrak's own data, and is subject to the limitations of that data.

If this is true about Google Maps accuracy, then, maybe Amtrak should throw out whatever system they are using and incorporate Google Maps into their system. Lots of other folks do just that

The existing implementation of Google Maps is precisely the other way around, as explained above. Transit systems that use Google Maps for trip planning are still dependent of the transit systems' underlying systems and their data exposed through GTFS. They are just using Google Maps as their UI instead of developing their own. The data is from the carrier. Google Maps can be no more accurate than the data it consumes.

And, yes, before we get to it, I agree that Amtrak's website UI/UX design is very poor, the technical term, I think, is "sucks". But the data is the same.

 

[user 14106]

Another note I was made aware of about the Corridor units through some of the NGEC stuff, apparently Amtrak has suggested an overhaul program to the midwest states that would make some modifications and hopefully improve reliability in these units, but the midwest pool states have not yet funded this work. Apparently IDOT put in for some federal funding for it that was not granted during either the last CRISI or FedState round. So the state owners have some responsibility as well. Again - I get it that the passengers don't care and are just going to blame Amtrak, but the facts matter if you are talking about accountability. Amtrak is in a much stronger position with the ALC 42s because with the TSSSA Siemens has a direct contractual requirement to address issues and Amtrak has way more leverage and ability to exert pressure. They also don't have to wait for parts as long due to the same agreement - supply chain for parts has been a massive problem for the corridor units. The midwest states and California are both working to get their Chargers on TSSSA's but it's been a very long process negotiating those. I believe separatly Amtrak and Washington state are working to get the Washington state units on a TSSSA as well.

 

[Steve4031]

A friend of mine who is a non rail fan took 48 from Chicago to Syracuse in coach for her first train trip. I just gave her the information and helped her book the ticket. I did not share my concerns about dining car service and lounge car food.

She texted me this morning m(left last night) and she told me she was enjoying the trip. She even likes how it rides. So the rough rides over interlocking did not phase her.

 

[TransitTyrant]

Another note I was made aware of about the Corridor units through some of the NGEC stuff, apparently Amtrak has suggested an overhaul program to the midwest states that would make some modifications and hopefully improve reliability in these units, but the midwest pool states have not yet funded this work. Apparently IDOT put in for some federal funding for it that was not granted during either the last CRISI or FedState round. So the state owners have some responsibility as well. Again - I get it that the passengers don't care and are just going to blame Amtrak, but the facts matter if you are talking about accountability. Amtrak is in a much stronger position with the ALC 42s because with the TSSSA Siemens has a direct contractual requirement to address issues and Amtrak has way more leverage and ability to exert pressure. They also don't have to wait for parts as long due to the same agreement - supply chain for parts has been a massive problem for the corridor units. The midwest states and California are both working to get their Chargers on TSSSA's but it's been a very long process negotiating those. I believe separatly Amtrak and Washington state are working to get the Washington state units on a TSSSA as well.

According to the Midwest Interstate Passenger Rail Commission Amtrak is the one applying for CRISI grants for locomotive rehabs. Perhaps the states are asking Amtrak to do it for them or Amtrak is taking the initiative, either way it’s clear they aren’t sitting idle.

 

[user 14106]

According to the Midwest Interstate Passenger Rail Commission Amtrak is the one applying for CRISI grants for locomotive rehabs. Perhaps the states are asking Amtrak to do it for them or Amtrak is taking the initiative, either way it’s clear they aren’t sitting idle.

At the NGEC meeting it was stated that IDOT applied for a FedState national network partnership grant I believe that it did not receive. Amtrak may very well be advancing subsequent efforts to fund these under CRISI.

 

[Rasputin]

Granted that Amtrak primarily operates its P42 locomotives on long distance trains and VIA uses its P42s in corridor service, I have never understood why Amtrak has occasional to regular breakdowns of its P42 en route while VIA's P42s seem to operate problem-free.

I have assumed that it is a maintenance issue and therefore a management issue that Amtrak seems to have but VIA does not.

 

[user 14106]

I have assumed that it is a maintenance issue and therefore a management issue that Amtrak seems to have but VIA does not.

VIA’s corridor routes do not have the same obsessive foamer base monitoring everything that happens as does Amtrak’s long haul routes.

 

[Amtrak25]

Yes it does. It is an email group with members. I am in it, but only to hear what goes on. I get multiple emails daily.

Every Canadian consist by car number, all corridor equipment cycles, seat reassignments by changed equipment, equipment substitutions from Venture troubles, a meltdown a week or two ago by a protest of Toronto based corridor engineers, an LRC coach assigned to the Jonquire train, wanderings of the Panorama cars - just off the top of my head, everything is duly noted.

 

[Rasputin]

VIA’s corridor routes do not have the same obsessive foamer base monitoring everything that happens as does Amtrak’s long haul routes.

I think that those of us who participate in Canadian Passenger rail lists find this to be not true as Amtrak 25 has noted.

 

[user 14106]

Alright I’ll concede the point of the email list. But I standby the point that much of the belly aching about locomotives being purely the fault of Amtrak is based on pure speculation with very little evidence presented (and sometimes counter to the available evidence.)

I think many people tend to be more forgiving towards VIA because they do what many railfans love - run old Budd cars and F40 locomotives, domes, etc. But from my experience riding earlier this year it’s not that much different than Amtrak. The windows were the absolute filthiest I’ve ever seen on a train (far worse than any Amtrak train I’ve been on) and on board service in business I would say was alright but a step below Acela first. It wasn’t a bad trip but I certainly wasn’t blown away.

 

[Harmon Shay]

How does one get on this Canadian email list?

 

[Rasputin]

How does one get on this Canadian email list?

For starters, try this:

https://groups.io/g/Canadian-Passenger-Rail

This group is the successor to the Canadian-Passenger-Rail yahoogroup.

There are also several facebook groups which a search should turn up.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Granted that Amtrak primarily operates its P42 locomotives on long distance trains and VIA uses its P42s in corridor service, I have never understood why Amtrak has occasional to regular breakdowns of its P42 en route while VIA's P42s seem to operate problem-free.

I have assumed that it is a maintenance issue and therefore a management issue that Amtrak seems to have but VIA does not.

Amtraks P-42s have Many More Miles on them, and on lots of LD Routes there is only 1 pulling the Consist.( the Texas Eaglete is Example #1)

Not to mention the Maintainence Problems that have occurred @ Amtrak since the Bean Counters and Airline types have taken over.

 

[Harmon Shay]

For starters, try this:

https://groups.io/g/Canadian-Passenger-Rail

This group is the successor to the Canadian-Passenger-Rail yahoogroup.

There are also several facebook groups which a search should turn up.

Thanks very much.