Amtrak ONLY Rail Transit to Not Allow Pets!

[Ernest]

I want to go from Richmond, VA to Washington, DC, and Amtrak seemed at first a good way to go. Problem is Amtrak has a strict No Pets policy--not in even in hard sided carriers. Virtually ALL other rail transit companies I could find allow pet transit in some form or manner, including NYC, VRE, Boston, San Francisco, LA, Atlanta, Chicago--other transit systems that I've tried, so this discovery became a good reason to complain.

Here is the response provided Amtrak customer service in a reply e-mail:

While we certainly understand your wish to bring your pet on board Amtrak, we are not able to accommodate animals other than service animals for people with disabilities.

 

This policy was created to provide a comfortable environment for all our customers.

 

Many people choose to utilize independent pet transportation companies. While we cannot recommend one, they can be found in most yellow pages, through your veterinarian or on the Internet.

 

We hope this information is useful.

 

Sincerely,

 

Maureen

Frankly contrary to her words, I read neither an actual desire to understand, a willingness to be interested, nor any comprehension of what a pet owner is likely to do with their animal during transit. Just what does she mean by a comfortable environment for all our customers? Since the vast majority of other rail, airline, and ferry transport permit pets in carriers, does Amtrak think it understand passengers more than other system? Amtrak account balance sheet suggests otherwise.

I find it amazing that this response would claim that many people ride Amtrak and then use an independent pet transportation company to convey their small dogs--the largest constituency of pet owners. So, this claim is almost certainly not true. Rather, potential passengers find transit other than Amtrak, maybe renting a car or riding one of the many other urban rail transit systems.

It is quite apparent from this message that, unlike the many other transit system in the USA, Amtrak hasn't thoughtfully evaluated the transit opportunities for pet owners, and so looses yet another opportunity to raise revenue during a times of budget shortfall. Thanks for nothing Amtrak.

 

[AlanB]

Ernest,

The big difference between your examples and Amtrak is that all those other transit systems provide runs that are under 3 hours in total, if not far less. Now while your plaaned trip from Richmond to DC runs in the 2 and a half hour range, that doesn't apply to all trips. It is possible to book trips on Amtrak that last 2 days.

Two days is a lot to ask both of other people and your pet. Two days for those other passengers to endure possible barking. Or for those with allergies, two days of cat dander flying around their car.

 

[Wildcat]

I do not understand the pet fetish, no matter what. I have two cats... other than to the vet, they go nowhere with me. Some people find cats offensive; I generally find dogs offensive, no matter the breed.

What also troubles me is this sense of entitlement, particularly among pet owners. For instance, I live in a city where pets of all sorts are NOT allowed in restaurants or anywhere food is served (another reason why Amtrak won't allow pets). I was at a restaurant one morning for my bagel and coffee, and a couple walked in, followed by their dog (on a leash, at least). I told them that it was illegal to do that and they took offense, the wife saying, "we let our dog in the kitchen of our house; why not here." I immediately called the local police and they were johnny on the spot issuing a citation to the couple, and to the restaurant. The manager was fired within an hour for allowing it. But the looks of shock on the offending couple were amazing: like this had never, ever, ever happened to them anywhere before.

Rubbish.

So keep the dog home or use a service or stay home. I don't want a mutt on a train anywhere near me.

 

[ehbowen]

Agreed. I believe that sometime shortly after the formation of Amtrak, the USDA (or perhaps some other agency with similar jurisdiction) issued regulations for common carriers transporting animals which Amtrak found to be overly burdensome....minimum/maximum allowable temperatures (baggage cars are not air conditioned), rest and exercise breaks (and the liability for handling animals during them, not to mention delay of trains while these breaks occurred) and other such. The upshot was that Amtrak declined to carry animals any longer, unless those animals were trained service animals cared for by the passenger. However, one loophole which has been discussed here previously is that Amtrak will not ask for any certification or proof that the animal has been specially trained or even what disability the passenger is claiming; they will take the owner's word that it is a "trained service animal" and allow it aboard to be cared for by the passenger.

 

[benjibear]

Could you imagine having your pet in a carrier for days as somebody does a cross country trip? Where is the pet going to go to the bathroom, eat, and what if the pet gets restless? Think of other people that will be riding with you in the same car that has to endure the smell, dander if they have alergies, and possibly a barking dog or meowing cat? The other examples you give are either city transit companies or short commuter type lines. While I understand you are not going a long distance on your trip, the train starts and/or stops long after you get on or off. If Amtrak would allow you to do a short trip, it would be a slippery slope of where they cut off. I don'rt see it as being feasible.

Also, I want to correct you on your dog statistic. The largest number of pet owners have cats then small dogs. I remeber reading that like 40% of the population has a dog (all size dogs) while it is only slightly less for cats but more cat owners have mutilple cats while dog owners typically only have one dog. I would say cats outnumber small dogs by at least 2 to 1.

 

[Peter KG6LSE]

How is Fido any less dander then a seeing eye dog ? .. It's not .. regardless if the animal is considered "medical equipment" or a pet .

I doubt there will be a railcar full of pets if amtrak was to permit it .I used to fly a ton .. I have only seen a dog in a aircraft cabin in 2X in 20 years ..

A DC9 is way more air tight then a super liner ..

If we had better cars with better filtration AKA no more 1970s tin cans . then this {Might} not be a issue .

Thus we need more funds in to amtrak to fund better cars to have better service ..

In the end .. rail more fly less...

Oh and the topic of comfort ... I dont like some dude or lady with half a gallon of AXE body spray Or Musk sitting next to me ..

what can I do about it but be Miserable ! the entire 3 day trip .. I rather smell Wet Dog then some deer musk..

Edit as 97 more posts were done in the time i took fo rme to type this ..

I DONT condone pets in most places ..

I have a cat at my moms house ... and I would never subject him to travle .

USDA is one thing I can understand ... but to say its for others comfort is not entirey true ..



Peter

 

[Agent]

I'm pretty sure that VIA Rail in Canada doesn't allow pets either.

 

[zephyr17]

I'm pretty sure that VIA Rail in Canada doesn't allow pets either.

Not in passenger cars, but they still allow them to be carried in baggage cars. Owner responsible for food, water and "walking".

 

[me_little_me]

Agreed. I believe that sometime shortly after the formation of Amtrak, the USDA (or perhaps some other agency with similar jurisdiction) issued regulations for common carriers transporting animals which Amtrak found to be overly burdensome....minimum/maximum allowable temperatures (baggage cars are not air conditioned), rest and exercise breaks (and the liability for handling animals during them, not to mention delay of trains while these breaks occurred) and other such. The upshot was that Amtrak declined to carry animals any longer, unless those animals were trained service animals cared for by the passenger. However, one loophole which has been discussed here previously is that Amtrak will not ask for any certification or proof that the animal has been specially trained or even what disability the passenger is claiming; they will take the owner's word that it is a "trained service animal" and allow it aboard to be cared for by the passenger.

Not quite. And your posting sounds like an encouragement to cheat the system which can result in the pet and/or owner subject to involuntary removal.

From the Amtrak Standards Manual:

3. Determining If An Animal Is A Service Animal – “Is This Your Pet”

a) Physical Indicators – Look for physical indicators on the animal. Some service animals wear harnesses, vests, capes or backpacks. Markings on these items or on the animal’s tags may identify it as a service animal. The absence of such equipment however, does not necessarily mean the animal is not a service animal.

b) Observation – Observe the animal’s behavior. Service animals are trained to behave properly in public settings. For example, a properly trained guide dog will not run around the station, bark or growl at other passengers, or bite or jump on people.

• Some service animals provide assistance or perform specific services.

• Service animals are not pets; they are working animals that are specifically trained to provide assistance for individuals who have disabilities.

• Some service animals can help a person by pulling a wheelchair, fetching dropped items, handling money, carrying bags, opening doors or assisting a person with a visual impairment.

• Some service animals serve as seizureresponse/alert animals for people with seizure disorders or alert individuals with impaired hearing to intruders or sounds.

c) Is This Your Pet

Credible verbal assurances is needed from the passenger that the animal is a service animal. The way to do this:

• Ask the passenger, “Is this your pet?”

If the passenger responds that the animal is a service animal and not a pet, but uncertainty remains about the animal, you may ask appropriate follow up questions.

• Ask the passenger, “What tasks or functions does your animal perform for you?” or “What has it been trained to do for you?”

The passenger must respond that the animal acts as a guide, notifies of a seizures, etc.

 

Service Standards Manual No. 6 11-13

11-14 Assisting Passengers with Disabilities

Employees may not ask the passenger what his/her disability is or the cause of the disability.

• Although there may be a few people who try to “beat the system” by bringing pets on-board the train, most passengers with disabilities claiming to have service animals really do have service animals.

• Since access for persons with disabilities traveling with service animals is a civil right covered under the ADA, employees should err on the side of caution by permitting access to passenger areas. If the animal looks like a service animal and the customer says it is a service animal welcome the animal aboard.

d) Not a Service Animal

• If an animal is determined not to be a service animal or if the service animal poses a direct threat to others, the animal can be denied access to Amtrak premises.

• On the rare occasion that an animal has to be excluded from Amtrak premises, you should handle the situation in a polite and professional manner.

• When an animal is excluded from Amtrak premises while en route, the employee making this decision must complete a “Passenger Incident Report” (NRPC 3200) detailing the incident.

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

b) Observation – Observe the animal’s behavior. Service animals are trained to behave properly in public settings. For example, a properly trained guide dog will not run around the station, bark or growl at other passengers, or bite or jump on people.

I do believe this screening should apply to some passengers as well :lol:

 

[Anderson]

I'll offer a personal example: I am catastrophically allergic to cats, to the point that were I stuck in the same coach as one for a day or two...well, let's just say that point blank I couldn't be because of the dander and my body's reaction to it. I would be sneezing and breaking out in hives under those circumstances, in all likelihood (particularly if I'd had some "reinforcing" exposure beforehand). I can take at most an hour or two in the same house as a friend's cats, and even then I'm usually an absolute miserable mess by the end of it.

Also:

• Some service animals can help a person by pulling a wheelchair, fetching dropped items, handling money, carrying bags, opening doors or assisting a person with a visual impairment.

 

Handling money? I didn't know they were hiring apes at the banks these days. Banana for a credit default swap?

 

[sunchaser]

I want to go from Richmond, VA to Washington, DC, and Amtrak seemed at first a good way to go. Problem is Amtrak has a strict No Pets policy--not in even in hard sided carriers. Virtually ALL other rail transit companies I could find allow pet transit in some form or manner, including NYC, VRE, Boston, San Francisco, LA, Atlanta, Chicago--other transit systems that I've tried, so this discovery became a good reason to complain.

Here is the response provided Amtrak customer service in a reply e-mail:

While we certainly understand your wish to bring your pet on board Amtrak, we are not able to accommodate animals other than service animals for people with disabilities.

 

This policy was created to provide a comfortable environment for all our customers.

 

Many people choose to utilize independent pet transportation companies. While we cannot recommend one, they can be found in most yellow pages, through your veterinarian or on the Internet.

 

We hope this information is useful.

 

Sincerely,

 

Maureen

Frankly contrary to her words, I read neither an actual desire to understand, a willingness to be interested, nor any comprehension of what a pet owner is likely to do with their animal during transit. Just what does she mean by a comfortable environment for all our customers? Since the vast majority of other rail, airline, and ferry transport permit pets in carriers, does Amtrak think it understand passengers more than other system? Amtrak account balance sheet suggests otherwise.

I find it amazing that this response would claim that many people ride Amtrak and then use an independent pet transportation company to convey their small dogs--the largest constituency of pet owners. So, this claim is almost certainly not true. Rather, potential passengers find transit other than Amtrak, maybe renting a car or riding one of the many other urban rail transit systems.

It is quite apparent from this message that, unlike the many other transit system in the USA, Amtrak hasn't thoughtfully evaluated the transit opportunities for pet owners, and so looses yet another opportunity to raise revenue during a times of budget shortfall. Thanks for nothing Amtrak.

As a pet owner, sometimes I think it would be nice to take my Blue and Gold Macaw with me. Then I realize he may not like it, and would probably make everyone miserable if I could bring him. I know your trip is fairly short, but on long distance trains it can be up to an 8 hour time span between stops. That would be awful for a dog. Many people are allergic to dogs, cats and even birds. I'm sure your pet is well mannered, quiet and housebroken, but many pets are not. I think the only real solution would be a 'pet car', but I doubt if anything like that will surface. Even if it did, I probably still would not take my bird, because he's not used to being around dogs anymore, he would probably screech very loudly!

 

[Agent]

I'm pretty sure that VIA Rail in Canada doesn't allow pets either.

Not in passenger cars, but they still allow them to be carried in baggage cars. Owner responsible for food, water and "walking".

Okay, thanks for clarifying.

 

[GoldenSpike]

I have only seen a dog in a aircraft cabin in 2X in 20 years ..

On a recent flight, the young lady ahead of me while boarding had a cat in her carry-on (mesh ventilation on each end).

I didn't know they were allowed. Unknown if the cat had to go through the TSA grope.

 

[me_little_me]

I'll offer a personal example: I am catastrophically allergic to cats, to the point that were I stuck in the same coach as one for a day or two...well, let's just say that point blank I couldn't be because of the dander and my body's reaction to it. I would be sneezing and breaking out in hives under those circumstances, in all likelihood (particularly if I'd had some "reinforcing" exposure beforehand). I can take at most an hour or two in the same house as a friend's cats, and even then I'm usually an absolute miserable mess by the end of it.

Also:

• Some service animals can help a person by pulling a wheelchair, fetching dropped items, handling money, carrying bags, opening doors or assisting a person with a visual impairment.

 

Handling money? I didn't know they were hiring apes at the banks these days. Banana for a credit default swap?

Upscale Service tarantulas like mine are trained to use credit cards. Mine carries a Chase Rare Earth Plus card as it isn't allowed to collect AGR points - it rides for free.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

I currently Have 8 cats. I used to have a dog and a cat but had to put the dog down due to a tumor. I love both cats and dogs but can't see on bringing them with me on a cross country trip. Find a pet sitter or hire a friend to pet sit the animals while your away.

 

[amamba]

I think we can all agree that pets should not be allowed on long trips - cross country, overnight, etc.

But I do think its somewhat annoying that one can't take a small dog or cat in a carrier on a short jaunt down the NEC. I would love to take the train around the holidays as my parents live outside of PHL, but I always have to drive because I'm not leaving my dog at home during the holidays. My dog would happily sleep for the 4 hour trip from PVD - PHL on acela, and frankly he goes 8 hours a day while I am at work without a bathroom break.

But yeah, I understand why amtrak has the policy that it does because it is easier for them to have it black and white than more nuanced, like pets allowed in hard sided carriers on trips of less than three hours or something. But I think it is fair for folks to vent their displeasure about it without everyone going crazy.

My husband is just as allergic to cats as another poster, and unfortunately we did once find ourselves seated on a plane with a person with a cat in between us and the cat underneath the seat in front of us. We asked the FA to switch because of his allergies and we were accommodated to an empty row at back, but that was 6 years ago when I know planes were a lot less full.

 

[sunchaser]

I think we can all agree that pets should not be allowed on long trips - cross country, overnight, etc.

But I do think its somewhat annoying that one can't take a small dog or cat in a carrier on a short jaunt down the NEC. I would love to take the train around the holidays as my parents live outside of PHL, but I always have to drive because I'm not leaving my dog at home during the holidays. My dog would happily sleep for the 4 hour trip from PVD - PHL on acela, and frankly he goes 8 hours a day while I am at work without a bathroom break.

But yeah, I understand why amtrak has the policy that it does because it is easier for them to have it black and white than more nuanced, like pets allowed in hard sided carriers on trips of less than three hours or something. But I think it is fair for folks to vent their displeasure about it without everyone going crazy.

My husband is just as allergic to cats as another poster, and unfortunately we did once find ourselves seated on a plane with a person with a cat in between us and the cat underneath the seat in front of us. We asked the FA to switch because of his allergies and we were accommodated to an empty row at back, but that was 6 years ago when I know planes were a lot less full.

I think the biggest problems would be the allergy risk and safety issues/risks of bites, etc.

Also sound factor-as long as the pet isn't barking/meowing/whining/screeching.

That is an unpredictable factor-you can't guarantee your pet will be quiet, any more than someone can guarantee a baby won't cry for all or part of the trip. For example, my bird is doing his daily afternoon squawk-fest right now!

 

[amtrakwolverine]

Also How would you feel if fido got loose from his cage and got startled and when a little kid reached down to pet the dog the dog attacked. Maybe allow pets on trains that have a baggage or cabbage car and the route is under a certain time and you have to pay to take the dog or cat with you just like bikes.When you book your revvy you have to choose if you're bringing any pets and what kind and limit it to 1 pet per reservation.If the baggage or cabbage is not running then your outta luck.

 

[amamba]

I think the biggest problems would be the allergy risk and safety issues/risks of bites, etc.

Also sound factor-as long as the pet isn't barking/meowing/whining/screeching.

That is an unpredictable factor-you can't guarantee your pet will be quiet, any more than someone can guarantee a baby won't cry for all or part of the trip. For example, my bird is doing his daily afternoon squawk-fest right now!

These are all "problems" that the airline industry manages to face, and again, safety issues should be mitigated if the animal is in a carrier.

I am just pointing out that many commuter/short haul railroads and airlines allow animals that meet certain guidelines to be brought aboard the passenger cabin, and personally I would like to do be able to do the same on short trips on the NEC. I understand why they don't do it, but I think its a valid complaint.

 

[amamba]

Also How would you feel if fido got loose from his cage and got startled and when a little kid reached down to pet the dog it the dog attacked. maybe allow pets on trains that have a baggage or cabbage car and the route is under a certain time and you have to pay to take the dog or cat with you just like bikes etc and if the baggage or cabbage is not running then your outta luck.

Have you ever heard of this happening on a plane or some other sort of public transit where animals in carriers are allowed?

Allowing dogs in a baggage car would not be sufficient on the NEC because only the 66/67 runs with baggage between BOS - NYP.

 

[Peter KG6LSE]

I have only seen a dog in a aircraft cabin in 2X in 20 years ..

On a recent flight, the young lady ahead of me while boarding had a cat in her carry-on (mesh ventilation on each end).

I didn't know they were allowed. Unknown if the cat had to go through the TSA grope.

HAHAH I don't know who to be more sorry for .. the Cat or the TSA .....

Perhaps a way to solve this is to charge a normal human fee for any animal .. pooch or Puss does take up revenue space does it not ..

There ya go . charge a paw and tail and get new filters that way ..

 

[RRUserious]

I bet if you took a vote on how many passengers want someone ELSE'S animal in the car with them, the answer would be pretty overwhelmingly no. My house is full of pets. When we both go somehwere (not a frequent thing), my wife finds people to give them attention in our home. I doubt she'd consider taking them in a private car, let alone a public transport. I think I can safely generalize that NO ONE loves your pet as much as you do. It (or they) are no gift to society. Local people here seem to want to take their dogs into everywhere and complain about lack of "dog friendly stores". Uh, I think its safe to say since the HUMANS pay the freight, the owners tilt toward human-friendly stores, which probably trumps the dog-friendly option.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Most of the problems people seem to have with pets would not appear to be a huge issue when caged on a commute length run or kept in a baggage car on a long distance run. I know there are reasons why this is not allowed anyway, but I could see some room for compromise if handled carefully.

 

[sunchaser]

I think the biggest problems would be the allergy risk and safety issues/risks of bites, etc.

Also sound factor-as long as the pet isn't barking/meowing/whining/screeching.

That is an unpredictable factor-you can't guarantee your pet will be quiet, any more than someone can guarantee a baby won't cry for all or part of the trip. For example, my bird is doing his daily afternoon squawk-fest right now!

These are all "problems" that the airline industry manages to face, and again, safety issues should be mitigated if the animal is in a carrier.

I am just pointing out that many commuter/short haul railroads and airlines allow animals that meet certain guidelines to be brought aboard the passenger cabin, and personally I would like to do be able to do the same on short trips on the NEC. I understand why they don't do it, but I think its a valid complaint.

Just last week a dog escaped it carrier and was on the tarmac for quite a while before the owner was able to coax it back into the carrier. As I said before, I sometimes think about taking my pet, but I'm being selfish when I do. He may not enjoy it as much as I want him along. I have taken him camping before, and he was upset for a while then would settle down. To me, it's just more to take care of and keep track of on the trip. I certainly would not subject him to being in baggage. The noise would freak him out so bad that I don't think I would be able to control him. I don't have a real problem with others having pets aboard as long as there are no problems with it.