Brightline Trains Florida discussion

[jis]

So I do apologize to him for making false statements about his actions. He says he did call 911 before the crash as soon as he saw the truck was stuck - it seems that 2 or 3 minutes is not enough time for 911 to contact FECR about a crossing incursion. That is what needs to be investigated.

Even though it might say FECR for the number on the sign at the crossing, the actual entity that would handle such calls is the Florida Dispatching Company, since they control the traffic on that trackage.

 

[Brian_tampa]

Even though it might say FECR for the number on the sign at the crossing, the actual entity that would handle such calls is the Florida Dispatching Company, since they control the traffic on that trackage.

I wonder how 911 centers handle calls like this? There must be a procedure they have to try to quickly contact the dispatch center for the railroad. I can understand why the guy videoing the scene did not approach the crossing, due to perceived danger, and instead chose to call 911 from his phone from across the street. The truck driver was definitely at fault here for not calling the railroad number posted on the crossing signal (and for getting stuck).

 

[joelkfla]

A peek inside the airport station head house under construction (pretty much just an empty shell at this point):

 

[jis]

Two more sets on delivery trip to Florida

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-rev...oto-new-brightline-trains-heading-to-florida/
They will be delivered to the OIA facility.

 

[jis]

Here is a good explanation of what transpired causing the selection of the new route. There is some new information about why CFX cannot lease the RoW along 417 without running afoul of their previous Eminent Domain agreement with Hunter's Creek, something that I was unaware of.

https://www.railwayage.com/passenger/intercity/why-mickey-mouse-wont-get-his-brightline-station/

 

[joelkfla]

Here is a good explanation of what transpired causing the selection of the new route. There is some new information about why CFX cannot lease the RoW along 417 without running afoul of their previous Eminent Domain agreement with Hunter's Creek, something that I was unaware of.

https://www.railwayage.com/passenger/intercity/why-mickey-mouse-wont-get-his-brightline-station/

I didn't know they were designing for 90 mph between OIA & Disney. That's rather disappointing.

 

[west point]

90 vs 125 MPH will equal what at most 2 minutes. The 417 route was planned at 125. But now we find 417 is a no go unless a very messy emminent domain fight. At first the now planned route was 125 but costs double what 417 would be. A very pragmatic decision to go with 90 IMHO>

 

[joelkfla]

90 vs 125 MPH will equal what at most 2 minutes. The 417 route was planned at 125. But now we find 417 is a no go unless a very messy emminent domain fight. At first the now planned route was 125 but costs double what 417 would be. A very pragmatic decision to go with 90 IMHO>

More like 1 minute. I hadn't realized that the distance actually along 417 would have been only about 5 miles.

 

[jis]

Brightline raising the testing speed limit to 79mph in Brevard County in Melbourne and Rockledge, North of Post Road (inclusive)

https://bit.ly/3Q4mbCP (PDF)

 

[user 1215]

Drove the 528 today. There is rail on all but 2 miles of the ROW. Lots still not tied or ballasted beyond that, but looking better every week!

 

[cirdan]

More like 1 minute. I hadn't realized that the distance actually along 417 would have been only about 5 miles.

I don’t know about speeds along the straight bit but some of those curves and zig zags look as though they may need tighter speed restrictions than that . In which case it is a legitimate question to ask what the point of accelerating is when you only need to applying brakes less than a minute later

 

[jis]

An unequivocal endorsement of Brightline with a reasonable discussion of public vs. private funding issues peculiar to the US.

 

[user 1215]

An unequivocal endorsement of Brightline with a reasonable discussion of public vs. private funding issues peculiar to the US.

Great report, but I disagree with his assertation that if Brightline fails, Amtrak should take it over. More like Brightline should start taking over sections of Amtrak - one line at a time. Of course, then those lines won't be transportation welfare anymore.

 

[Tlcooper44]

Great report, but I disagree with his assertation that if Brightline fails, Amtrak should take it over. More like Brightline should start taking over sections of Amtrak - one line at a time. Of course, then those lines won't be transportation welfare anymore.

Transportation Welfare?

Not sure your ideology on transportation is grounded in reality or fact.
Brightline can yank service at a moment's notice if they so choose (From March 2020 till Nov 2021). Amtrak doesn't have that luxury, and rightly so.
Not sure I want Brightline running anything close to a national rail network, some parts of which are infinitely more complex (the NEC) than the current Orlando-Miami corridor.

Not saying they can't manage a small route here and there (they do so quite well), but lets not get things mixed because we have an antiquated and obsolete view that transportation related companies should make money.

 

[pennyk]

MODERATOR NOTE: Several posts in this thread were off topic as to Brightline and were moved to a new thread:

https://www.amtraktrains.com/threads/amtrak-in-florida.82671/#post-968402

 

[Anderson]

I came across this video today of the Brightline crash several months ago involving an auto carrier truck stuck on the tracks in Lantana. I don't know if this has already been posted before here. This video should be required viewing for driver education classes, and for anyone cited for disobeying rail crossing laws.

So, I do have one observation here: If they had quad gates and some sort of trigger where if the gate won't go down, the train is directed to drop its speed (there being a presumed obstacle), that might help with this sort of thing. I guess the question there would be one of false positives and so on.

[The other thought that comes to mind is having some sort of video-monitored "emergency switch" - I suggest video monitoring because I'd want to prosecute anyone pulling a false alarm - at each crossing. I know some crossings have callboxes, but I don't think it's all of them.]

Finally:

The red dot in both cases is where the accident occurred, and the train was going SB.

I don't know where the engineer should have been able to see or if he'd have been able to stop in time if he'd gone into emergency if a gate smacking the truck had ordered him to do so. He was already slowing down at the time of impact (the train only went a little way past the crossing) but I don't recall if that's a 79 zone, slightly slower, etc.

 

[joelkfla]

So, I do have one observation here: If they had quad gates and some sort of trigger where if the gate won't go down, the train is directed to drop its speed (there being a presumed obstacle), that might help with this sort of thing. I guess the question there would be one of false positives and so on.

[The other thought that comes to mind is having some sort of video-monitored "emergency switch" - I suggest video monitoring because I'd want to prosecute anyone pulling a false alarm - at each crossing. I know some crossings have callboxes, but I don't think it's all of them.]

Finally:
View attachment 28995View attachment 28996
The red dot in both cases is where the accident occurred, and the train was going SB.

I don't know where the engineer should have been able to see or if he'd have been able to stop in time if he'd gone into emergency if a gate smacking the truck had ordered him to do so. He was already slowing down at the time of impact (the train only went a little way past the crossing) but I don't recall if that's a 79 zone, slightly slower, etc.

I think there was talk of installing intrusion detectors tied into PTC at crossings on the newly reconstructed double-trackage north of WPB. I don't know whether they've gone forward with that, nor whether there were plans to retrofit crossings between WPB & MIA.

On other railroads, intrusion detectors using radar were found to be superior to ones using magnetic loops.

 

[jis]

Trains article on Brightline 79mph testing...

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-rev...9-mph-testing-on-section-of-route-to-orlando/

 

[Qapla]

With the Brightline locomotives - do the engineers drive seated or standing?

 

[jis]

With the Brightline locomotives - do the engineers drive seated or standing?

Seated in a very comfortable chair.

 

[bonzoesc]

Trains article on Brightline 79mph testing...

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-rev...9-mph-testing-on-section-of-route-to-orlando/

I've been thankful every time I go that the people of Brevard don't drive like everyone down here in the 305, but 110mph is a lot.

 

[Tlcooper44]

Trains article on Brightline 79mph testing...

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-rev...9-mph-testing-on-section-of-route-to-orlando/

This article said 2023 is service start, but I’ve recently read and seen that Brightline will make its original deadline of Q4 2022. Which is it?

 

[jis]

This article said 2023 is service start, but I’ve recently read and seen that Brightline will make its original deadline of Q4 2022. Which is it?

They will start test runs in '22, but service start date is tentatively sometime in 1CQ23. There will be a good 3 to 4 months window for testing and validation of the infrastructure.

 

[jis]

MODERATOR'S NOTE: A number of general posts (not specific to Brightline) regarding protection of occupants of the engine/cab during collisions have been moved to their own thread at:

https://www.amtraktrains.com/threads/protection-for-people-in-engine-cab-in-collisions.82701/
Please continue the cab protection related general discussion there, and leave this thread for discussing Brightline Florida.

Thank you for your understanding, cooperation and participation.

 

[Anderson]

They will start test runs in '22, but service start date is tentatively sometime in 1CQ23. There will be a good 3 to 4 months window for testing and validation of the infrastructure.

They also made some noise last month about possibly getting started for the holiday season of 2022.