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What is going to be very important is the loading gauge of these trains. Is CA HSR go with Amtrak's MAX gauge or maybe wider and taller than present Superliners and new Western trains yet to be specified? It could be that the cars might have the exit vestibules are at present widths. Then the outside could be wider about 2 - 4 inches above the vestibule widths giving much wider inside allowing seat being wider? All this will depend on clearances on Caltrain, transit center in downtown San Fran, Sab Jose, and LAX Union Station which will be getting a rebuild shortly.
They most likely are going to use the Siemens Velaro Nova wide which is 3300mm wide. that would also mean 7 93ft cars vs 8 85ft cars
They've long ago decided trains will be ~50in floor height
 
Since this is the newest and most up to date thread on the subject, (I think anyways.... ) I'm going to post this here since manufacturers and rolling stock and interiors (iirc) were posted upthread.

Interior renderings of CA Bullet Train....

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/high-speed-rail-train-18615271.php
Here they are without the ridiculous malware-infested ads:
https://www.trains.com/trn/news-rev...t-look-at-possible-high-speed-rail-interiors/
 
I have not experienced the Siemans cars in service now but those seats look as they wouldn't be any more comfortable. You hope Siemans and CHSRA will learn from that negative reaction and look to improve the comfort. But, I understand, they are simply concept images and the vendor has yet to be been chosen, so a long way to go.
 
You have to wonder if the same amount of money (probably less) had been invested in higher speed rail SFO - LAX - SAN on existing tracks including moving the LAX - SAN corridor away from the ocean, whether we would be better off. But that ship has sailed unfortunately.
It’s hard to look at a project like this - a pair of cities where true 350kph HSR makes absolutely perfect sense in every possible way - and have the foresight to know that higher speed rail would be the better option due to any number of factors contributing to ballooning costs.
From what I've garner, about half of the money has been spent on lawsuits dealing with opposition from acquiring land to construct the line, along with viaducts and relocations in order to grade separate and clear the ROW. There are some videos discussing the project.


its not just that. The fact that the project has taken so long due to lack of consistent funding (or withdrawal of current funding) and a constant fear of complete cancelation depending on the political landscape also contributes to ballooning costs.

If the project were 100% funded and 100% committed from the beginning, it’s possible it would have been done by now.
 
From what I've garner, about half of the money has been spent on lawsuits dealing with opposition from acquiring land to construct the line, along with viaducts and relocations in order to grade separate and clear the ROW.
That is what I have seen and heard as well, including the funding/rescinding issues mentioned by @Tlcooper44, and the delays/inflation resulting therefrom. There's also the matter of not having a robust HSR industry established at the regional, domestic, continental, or hemispheric level. If real HSR does take off in CA and/or NV future HSR projects might get a lot faster and cheaper if the industry and regulators can maintain momentum from one project to the next.
 
If they really wish to buy off the shelf then they will be the same height as the Avelia or the Velaro. If they wish to buy some other size then all bets are off on the alleged cost advantage of buying off the shelf.
I don't think there is a shelf to buy off. Siemens Velaro is by definition variable in terms of width and height.

Every one of the customers who has bought a Velaro so far has ordered something slightly different.

Thus Siemens likes to speak of the Velaro as a "platform" rather than as an out-of-the-box product.
 
That is what I have seen and heard as well, including the funding/rescinding issues mentioned by @Tlcooper44, and the delays/inflation resulting therefrom. There's also the matter of not having a robust HSR industry established at the regional, domestic, continental, or hemispheric level. If real HSR does take off in CA and/or NV future HSR projects might get a lot faster and cheaper if the industry and regulators can maintain momentum from one project to the next.
Wow, not really. Currently CHSRA has spent about $13B. Current Administrative costs, that include lawsuits are less than $500M. All lawsuits have been settled, most lost by the plaintiffs with the loser paying court costs.
 
That is what I have seen and heard as well, including the funding/rescinding issues mentioned by @Tlcooper44, and the delays/inflation resulting therefrom. There's also the matter of not having a robust HSR industry established at the regional, domestic, continental, or hemispheric level. If real HSR does take off in CA and/or NV future HSR projects might get a lot faster and cheaper if the industry and regulators can maintain momentum from one project to the next.
Here is detailed specifications on the Palmdale to Burbank EIR. https://hsr.ca.gov/wp-content/uploads/2024/06/Attachment-E-Exhibit-B-Findings-SOC_A11Y.pdf
 
https://caltrain-hsr.blogspot.com/2024/06/diridon-delusions.html
Clem from the renowned Caltrain-HSR Compatibility Blog made a new post, this one about Diridon Station alternatives being proposed. Some nice insight in how alternatives can be used to shape what might be a foregone conclusion by the planners (expensive viaduct to avoid an up-down escalator trip to platforms). Given Santa Clara's propensity to spend record highs on transit for fancy construction, I don't think it's a huge deal if they're willing to pay the cost.

I just wish the BART station was closer or had easier direct access to Diridon. If planners were serious about integrating (a la what MTC wayfinding project is trying to do), they would put some direct walkway connecting the two.
 
Here's a question:
Do y'all think California HSR will actually get done - in any amount of time?
Obviously there are a lot of considerations, and we may know more after November, but I am actually beginning to wonder what chance CAHSR has at actually being finished- with trains running (at the very least) from SF to LA. I would not count an operational central-valley-only segment as complete.

I've been seeing a lot of media suggesting scrapping the project is a legitimate possibility.
 
Here's a question:
Do y'all think California HSR will actually get done - in any amount of time?
Obviously there are a lot of considerations, and we may know more after November, but I am actually beginning to wonder what chance CAHSR has at actually being finished- with trains running (at the very least) from SF to LA. I would not count an operational central-valley-only segment as complete.

I've been seeing a lot of media suggesting scrapping the project is a legitimate possibility.
I think this project is at a point of too big to fail. It has also potentially destroyed any future entirely publicly funded true high speed rail projects in the US, especially if a certain political philosophy gains total control of government. But to abandon this project now would seem to be a monumental tragedy of epic proportions, given what has already been invested. I am just at a loss to know where the additional needed funds will come from.
 
You have to wonder if the same amount of money (probably less) had been invested in higher speed rail SFO - LAX - SAN on existing tracks including moving the LAX - SAN corridor away from the ocean, whether we would be better off. But that ship has sailed unfortunately.
What route could you do higher-speed rail on though? That's the issue.
 
What route could you do higher-speed rail on though? That's the issue.
Yep, the only way into the Bay Area that doesn't involve a crossing of the various coast ranges is the current route used by the San Joaquins. And at the other end, there's Tehachapi Pass, and then all the current rail lines that go into the Los Angeles Basin also have to cross mountain ranges. Not even "higher speed" running. I suppose that designing a 110-mph maximum route to cross those mountains in this seismically active region isn't going to be much cheaper than doing a 200-mph maximum speed route. I suppose they could save some money by ordering Airos instead of specialized 200 mph high speed train sets. Maybe they could save some money on some of the other engineering expenses if they design the route for 125 mph max instead of 200 mph max, but they really should build it on an alignment that could be upgraded to 200 mph max after the initial service is a success and there's more interest in funding things. But all the tunneling and viaducts and stuff is going to be wickedly expensive, whether they build it for 110 mph, 125 mph, or 200 mph.
 
Yep, the only way into the Bay Area that doesn't involve a crossing of the various coast ranges is the current route used by the San Joaquins. And at the other end, there's Tehachapi Pass, and then all the current rail lines that go into the Los Angeles Basin also have to cross mountain ranges. Not even "higher speed" running. I suppose that designing a 110-mph maximum route to cross those mountains in this seismically active region isn't going to be much cheaper than doing a 200-mph maximum speed route. I suppose they could save some money by ordering Airos instead of specialized 200 mph high speed train sets. Maybe they could save some money on some of the other engineering expenses if they design the route for 125 mph max instead of 200 mph max, but they really should build it on an alignment that could be upgraded to 200 mph max after the initial service is a success and there's more interest in funding things. But all the tunneling and viaducts and stuff is going to be wickedly expensive, whether they build it for 110 mph, 125 mph, or 200 mph.
The cheaper way would have been the 90s plan to run at 110mph down the coast.
Had a bond measure not failed in 1994 that could have been a good test bed and creation of state capacity which then could have moved over to CAHSRA resulting in prop1A running earlier like was originally planned.
 
The current planned approach to San Francisco is through Pacheco Pass more or less parallel to state highway 152. It will more or less follow the current railroad south of San Jose to Gilroy and then turn east, meeting the north-south route at a "Y" about half way between Merced and Madera. The current blub I just saw showed one tunnel of 13.5 miles in length. This is far in excess of the tunnel lengths I recall looking at 10 to15 years ago. I suspect a lot of this has to do with environmental insanity. This route is considerably shorter than the current Caltrain route. It will be a 220 mph route. Best I recall, the the grades were in the 2.5% and less range, so it would have been quite practical for diesel passenger operation.

The cheaper way would have been the 90s plan to run at 110mph down the coast.
Had a bond measure not failed in 1994 that could have been a good test bed and creation of state capacity which then could have moved over to CAHSRA resulting in prop1A running earlier like was originally planned.
This speeded up coast route was never a practical alternative. First and foremost the intermediate population centers are all in the Central Valley. Second, and a close second, geography makes a significant speed up of the coast line extremely expensive.
 
The current planned approach to San Francisco is through Pacheco Pass more or less parallel to state highway 152. It will more or less follow the current railroad south of San Jose to Gilroy and then turn east, meeting the north-south route at a "Y" about half way between Merced and Madera. The current blub I just saw showed one tunnel of 13.5 miles in length. This is far in excess of the tunnel lengths I recall looking at 10 to15 years ago. I suspect a lot of this has to do with environmental insanity. This route is considerably shorter than the current Caltrain route. It will be a 220 mph route. Best I recall, the the grades were in the 2.5% and less range, so it would have been quite practical for diesel passenger operation.
SJ to gilroy it will be the UP line with some minor realignment work and with 3-4 tracks. The tunnels haven't changed for Pacheco Pass they've always been around that long. It is close to a base tunnel to meet the 200-250mph design speed.
This speeded up coast route was never a practical alternative. First and foremost the intermediate population centers are all in the Central Valley. Second, and a close second, geography makes a significant speed up of the coast line extremely expensive.
There are some sections its easier than others but 110mph from San Jose to Guadalupe outside of Cuesta isn't that complex. South of that 90mph can be done for most of the route. Single level cars running at 6in would also help speeds some, but the old plans were all lets do super elevation for pax instead of being setup for freight and pax lives with it.
 
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