Derailment of Cascades #501, DuPont WA, 2017-12-18

[Milw6166]

The bridge is over the northbound lanes of I-5. (see the grafiti in photos) . The curve to the north of the southbound I-5 bridge is around 10 degrees which would definitely be slow speed and the junction with BNSF mainline is just ahead also a slower speed connection. So many factors to consider. I will just pray for all involved.

My mistake. It is the southbound lanes of I-5.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

this one seems especially short. Maybe it is normal.

Is that an entire car? Or only one piece of one that broke up?

 

[TrackWalker]

this one seems especially short. Maybe it is normal.

Is that an entire car? Or only one piece of one that broke up?

Optical illusion. It not only is going across the freeway, it is going under the bridge to a degree. Overhead views show it the same size as the others.

 

[frequentflyer]

this one seems especially short. Maybe it is normal.

Is that an entire car? Or only one piece of one that broke up?

Talgo cars are shorter than normal Amtrak Pax stock.

 

[frequentflyer]

http://web.talgoamerica.com/veryhighspeed-techspecmenu

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Ugh, more fodder for the government to get rid of Amtrak instead of getting us the money to improve.

This is the third major Amtrak wreck in as many years. If they cannot operate safely, at some point it will stop being simply fodder and they will have to have some kind of reckoning. If (and I stress if) it does turn out to be an over speed incident, you have to wonder if the company learned anything from 188.

Amtrak would have to experience a crash like this every few minutes just to catch up to automobile fatalities. At which point they'd soon run out of available power and active rolling stock. It's virtually impossible for passenger rail to become a bigger threat to life and limb than the primary alternative.

 

[Bierboy]

AP now also quoting a "U.S. official" that an obstruction is being considered as a possible cause...possibly a truck.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

A train type of truck, or a Mack type of truck?

Being on an overpass, I would think it wouldn't also be an at-grade crossing.

 

[Bierboy]

A train type of truck, or a Mack type of truck?

Being on an overpass, I would think it wouldn't also be an at-grade crossing.

Good question...there was a reference to a vehicle I believe, but, given where the wreckage ended up, it's hard to imagine, if it were a vehicle, that it happened at a grade crossing.

 

[Bierboy]

NTSB says "too early" to say if speed was the cause..."National Transportation Safety Board said it's too early to know if the crash was due to high speed.

Bella Dinh-Zarr, spokesperson for NTSB, said a team of 20 investigators will be at the scene later this evening and will be able to further assess at this point."

 

[AmtrakBlue]

There appears to be a service road by the bridge. A truck could easily have been on that road and fouled the tracks.

Sent from my iPhone using Amtrak Forum

 

[jis]

I wonder who this mystery US official is. Initially it was thought that it was someone from NTSB. But NTSB just said that they do not have that information. They are just putting together and getting an away team going. And yet AP has access to this anonymous US Official who's spilling a few beans. Very curious.

 

[Ngotwalt]

Let’s ask this question then, if the train were going track speed, 79MPH about to slow for a speed restriction, and it struck something, could that impact have somehow prevent the brakes from engaging? Usually when damage to the brake system occurs, pressure drops, brakes go on, train stops. The evidence seems to suggest an over speed derailment, how could an impact have damaged the equipment in such a way that the breaks failed to respond? I’m not by any means saying it’s impossible, but it is not scenario I have ever heard of...

Nick

 

[Rover]

A train type of truck, or a Mack type of truck?

Being on an overpass, I would think it wouldn't also be an at-grade crossing.

Good question...there was a reference to a vehicle I believe, but, given where the wreckage ended up, it's hard to imagine, if it were a vehicle, that it happened at a grade crossing.

Looking at the Google Maps view, there does not appear to be a crossing before the track curves over Interstate 5.

There is a road nearby (that appears to dead end) that has something to do with the golf course property adjacent to the track ?

The reason there are not ground photos from the South side of the train bridge is that area is private property with no apparent roads to that area near the bridge. And no News trucks or crews are being allowed to cross under the bridge?

 

[TrackWalker]

I wonder who this mystery US official is. Initially it was thought that it was someone from NTSB. But NTSB just said that they do not have that information. They are just putting together and getting an away team going. And yet AP has access to this anonymous US Official who's spilling a few beans. Very curious.

I recall after the derailment first happened reading that some local government official on the train tweeted that he thought they may have hit a truck....

 

[Bierboy]

Here's the exact text from AP rebstruction -- "An official briefed on the investigation told The Associated Press that preliminary signs indicate that Train 501 may have struck something before going off the track. The official was not authorized to discuss the investigation publicly and spoke to on the condition of anonymity."

 

[keelhauled]

Ugh, more fodder for the government to get rid of Amtrak instead of getting us the money to improve.

This is the third major Amtrak wreck in as many years. If they cannot operate safely, at some point it will stop being simply fodder and they will have to have some kind of reckoning. If (and I stress if) it does turn out to be an over speed incident, you have to wonder if the company learned anything from 188.

Amtrak would have to experience a crash like this every few minutes just to catch up to automobile fatalities. At which point they'd soon run out of available power and active rolling stock. It's virtually impossible for passenger rail to become a bigger threat to life and limb than the primary alternative.

Yes, but on the other hand airliners would have to fall out of the sky monthly to match Amtrak's fatality rate these last few years.

 

[s10mk]

I used the measuring tool in Google maps, and there was a distance of 1/4 mile between the spot where the cascades was clocked doing 81mph and the bend. Would that have been enough time for the train to deccelerate to a safe speed for that particular curve?

 

[KmH]

I think the train would have to emergency brake to have any hope of slowing down from 80 to 30 in that distance.

Wouldn't it have to be a sizable truck to derail the train? In other words a pickup truck is not likely to derail a train.

I think over speed for the curve is still the most likely cause.

Time will add clarity to what actually happened.

 

[jis]

If there was a truck involved, one wonders where it landed up. There is a surprising lack of any damage to the track as far as is visible. Very strange.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

Trump is saying that it is due to an aging overpass crumpling apart?

 

[norfolkwesternhenry]

Trump is saying that it is due to an aging overpass crumpling apart?

Wasn't the cutoff just constructed, or is this part of the old line.
Sent from my SM-G930P using Amtrak Forum mobile app

 

[JoeBas]

Trump is saying that it is due to an aging overpass crumpling apart?

*sigh*

 

[jis]

Welll.... completely meets expectations

 

[jis]

Trump is saying that it is due to an aging overpass crumpling apart?

Wasn't the cutoff just constructed, or is this part of the old line.
Sent from my SM-G930P using Amtrak Forum mobile app

It is part of an old line that was upgraded.