Empire Builder discussion

[jis]

Because the schedule doesn't allow it.

Indeed. Blithely saying that the Empire Builder could depart at 12:30 or earlier from Chicago to make the Seattle connection to the CS would break a lot of reliability in connections from the Eastern trains to the EB. I am sure the total revenues involved are way more in the eastern trains to EB connection than the few that would connect at Seattle instead of going to PDX where they can connect anyway.

 

[mackinaw chief]

Indeed. Blithely saying that the Empire Builder could depart at 12:30 or earlier from Chicago to make the Seattle connection to the CS would break a lot of reliability in connections from the Eastern trains to the EB. I am sure the total revenus involved are way more in the eastern trains to EB connection than the few that would connect a Seattle instead of going to PDX where they can connect anyway.

Can there be a choice? I think so. As opinion only. The Lake Shore is in CHI by 10 AM. The WAS trains are in well before noon last I recall. City of New Orleans is in before 10. Michigan is before noon. Hiawatha is in with 4 trains by 11 AM. So the only ones left is CZ. EB TE SWC . am I missing something here?

 

[AmtrakBlue]

Because the schedule doesn't allow it.

Well, then, they should change the schedule! I’m sure the host railroad will have no problem with that, nor the passengers down the line whose schedules will become unwanted.

 

[zephyr17]

Well, then, they should change the schedule! I’m sure the host railroad will have no problem with that, nor the passengers down the line whose schedules will become unwanted.

Not to mention making all the westward Chicago connections much more fraught, as @jis noted.

 

[zephyr17]

Can there be a choice? I think so. As opinion only. The Lake Shore is in CHI by 10 AM. The WAS trains are in well before noon last I recall. City of New Orleans is in before 10. Michigan is before noon. Hiawatha is in with 4 trains by 11 AM. So the only ones left is CZ. EB TE SWC . am I missing something here?

Yes.

Schedule reliability of the eastern LDs.

Just because a train is scheduled in by 10 does not mean every arrival, or even most of them, will actually do it.

The current western LD departures allow for a very comfortable margin of error, which I would argue is a necessity these days.

Disrupting the reliability of all Chicago connections to create an additional connection to the Coast Starlight that would benefit few people would be a remarkably stupid move. I don't think even current Amtrak management is that dumb.

 

[TimePeace]

EB #8 running about 12 hours late at Minot

 

[jis]

When Boardman was CEO I used to know several people in the planning department. Naturally I tended to come up with brilliant ideas involving tweaking a schedule by an hour to get some marginal gain (at least theoretically). We had lively discussions about those. The gentleman who was the right hand man of Boardman once explained to me that unless there is a huge life or death issue involved you never go to a host railroad asking for a schedule modification, since inevitably that brings out the counter-proposals to slow down the train to fit better in the freight flow. His point was that unless perceived gain was large in terms of revenue/ridership, it is better to let sleeping dogs lie and get enforcement of what we have. I am sure the situation is no different now, now that the STB thing is leading in general to hosts requesting slower schedules before they can guarantee compliance with the metrics.

So I think I am on pretty solid ground when I suggest that the proposed shuffling of EB or any schedule of this sort is not going to happen, specially if it involves maintaining total running time or reducing running time, unless it originates from the host railroad. Just my educated guess for reasons described above.

 

[mackinaw chief]

EB #8 running about 12 hours late at Minot

Looks like the swissotel will be busy tomorrow in CHI. Not fault of schedule. It's other factors with or without my suggestion.

 

[zephyr17]

EB #8 running about 12 hours late at Minot

Well, that will make for a very comfortable connection with 11(22) at Seattle, should anyone want to do it

 

[jis]

Well, that will make for a very comfortable connection with 11(22) at Seattle, should anyone want to do it

Except that 8 is running towards Chicago, not towards Seattle

 

[zephyr17]

Except that 8 is running towards Chicago, not towards Seattle

Doh!

 

[mackinaw chief]

Except that 8 is running towards Chicago, not towards Seattle

I almost had to edit my post above. Or have egg on my face whoops! Acronym soup can get me in deep quicksand .

 

[TimePeace]

So most passengers will be put up in Chicago and going on to Boston or New York they will probably lose their sleeper reservations. Not good... as a ubiquitous Maine bumper sticker reads "Compost Happens"...

 

[zephyr17]

So most passengers will be put up in Chicago and going on to Boston or New York they will probably lose their sleeper reservations. Not good...

Well, it is slow travel season right now, so chances of having some open rooms is probably pretty good, especially to NY with 2 sleepers on the LSL as well as the option of the Capitol.

Probably at least some connecting sleeper pax will get sleepers. I wonder what the criteria is for selecting those who get sleepers on delay-related rebooking when there is some sleeper space available, but not enough to go around?

BTW, that is why I almost always build in an overnight layover in Chicago eastbound.

 

[TimePeace]

It's nearly as I can tell this delay began at Spokane. Anybody know why?

 

[TimePeace]

"Official
Due to ongoing delays, An on-time section of Empire Builder Train 8 / Train 28 which departed Seattle (SEA) / Portland PDX) on 1/18 has been provided with alternate transportation between St Paul (MSP) and Chicago (CHI). For more information, please call or text 1-800-USA-RAIL."

I guess this means busses. Not a pretty picture.

 

[jis]

It's nearly as I can tell this delay began at Spokane. Anybody know why?

Disabled BNSF freight train west of Spokane, apparently.

8/28(19) and 7/27(21) are cancelled due to non availability of equipment caused by excessive delays en route.

 

[TimePeace]

Is that likely to have caused a lot of freight disruption as well?

 

[jis]

Is that likely to have caused a lot of freight disruption as well?

Presumably it disrupted the High Line around Spokane quite a bit. Haven;t heard any details of whatever happened to said freight.

 

[Northwestern]

Eastern Washington resident here located about 20 minutes from the Amtrak depot in Pasco. I'd be the first one on an inaugural Pasco-Spokane or Pasco-Seattle route. The problem is lack of awareness of train service out here, most people don't know we have a train to/from Portland but every time I've boarded the train to Portland, it's been packed. Amtrak doesn't have the equipment to handle more passengers (and honestly shouldn't want to be losing out on a Portland-Chicago passenger just because someone wants to make the 4 hour trip from Portland-Pasco).

The answer is getting more of the interest of the local politicans and getting support from residents of the Yakima and Kittas valley who are currently in a transit desert. Until this changes, the state DOT and politicians will only focus on the Portland-Seattle-Vancouver corridor which still hasn't recovered from the retirement of the Talgo's and the annulment of it's pre-covid service levels.

I really think eastern Oregon and Washington needs a passenger train. Something other than the graveyard shift Empire Builder. A Cascade train from Portland to Pasco to Spokane, I think, would generate a high ridership if it started out early in the morning.

 

[TimePeace]

Okay now it looks like the train is moving and has gotten as far as Fargo. Does this mean passengers are still probably on board and have not been put on buses?

 

[jis]

Okay now it looks like the train is moving and has gotten as far as Fargo. Does this mean passengers are still probably on board and have not been put on buses?

That notification say that an on time alternative has been provided between MSP and Chicago. It says nothing about busing the passengers on 8/28 as far as I can tell. It will get to MSP and CHI whenever it manages to do so.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

"Official
Due to ongoing delays, An on-time section of Empire Builder Train 8 / Train 28 which departed Seattle (SEA) / Portland PDX) on 1/18 has been provided with alternate transportation between St Paul (MSP) and Chicago (CHI). For more information, please call or text 1-800-USA-RAIL."

I guess this means busses. Not a pretty picture.

Or a stub train. It says on-time section.

 

[TimePeace]

Stub?

 

[AmtrakBlue]

Stub?

An engine and a couple of cars from Chicago.