Freight Derailment disrupts Capitol Limited 2/3/23

[ashleyryan15]

All of us should thank the powers that be that neither Capitol Limited was next to this freight when it derailed.

Luckily it would've had to be absurdly late or early for that to be a risk

 

[Cal]

Things aren’t looking great.

 

[joelkfla]

Seems like one of the cars containing vinyl chloride is increasing in temperature and pressure, and is at risk of exploding catastrophically and potentially setting off a chain reaction.

 

[west point]

DOT 111 cars? That is not good

 

[railiner]

Why can't they run the CL over either the Cardinal or the LSL route, to handle passengers between CHI & WAS? Even if they just added the CL equipment to the LSL to provide the capacity for displaced CL passengers; the westernmost parts of the routes overlap, and passengers bound for WAS or PGH could get there from NYP (though it might take an extra day.)

Seems to me, they could run the Cap over a CSX routing between Cleveland and Pittsburgh maybe…

 

[Green Maned Lion]

Oy. I have a 2/18 trip out of Chicago on the Cap. I have rebooked on the Cardinal. I guess I can take the Bus or an Uber home from Trenton.

 

[Skyline]

LSL route won't work because of tunnels and related NEC clearance issues for Superliners. Cardinal route is a possibility if CSX can find pilots and still it would take so much longer that they would run out of equipment and lead to random cancellations anyway. I suspect they could run alternate days at best.

If they could get CSX's permission they could run the Cap upto Albany I suppose, and then run a connecting special Empire Service to New York, if they can find the equipment.

It would make more sense to turn the Cap at Cleveland (which is difficult due to lack of infrastructure), and Pittsburgh and bus bridge in between, if there was the stomach to do so. But as we know given the situation with host railroad cooperation etc. the tendency is to punt.

If Pittsburgh was temporarily the western terminus for the CL, maybe a bus bridge between Pittsburgh and the LSL at Elyria, Cleveland, or Erie could work? Times between Pittsburgh and DC on the CL would need to be adjusted for the duration. The CL is only running one coach and one sleeper at present, so some days one bus might be able to handle it, other days a second might be needed.

 

[Railroad Bill]

Latest news is they are going to drain some of the tank cars into a ditch and then set it on fire??. 3:30pm today according to CNN is when the event is scheduled. Lots of people evacuated. Going to be a while until CAP runs on that route again.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Oy. I have a 2/18 trip out of Chicago on the Cap. I have rebooked on the Cardinal. I guess I can take the Bus or an Uber home from Trenton.

Smart Plan!

How had you originally planned to get home from WAS from the Cap, or were you getting OFF in Pittsburgh and taking the Pennsy to Philly, then home???

And since the Eastbound Cardinal usually runs really Late, will there be Buses and/or Ride Share in Trenton in the Wee Hours???

 

[Rover]

Ohio Gov. Mike DeWine urged residents near the site of a train derailment in East Palestine to evacuate the area immediately as officials planned to conduct a “controlled release” of toxic chemicals from the burning wreckage on Monday afternoon to reduce the risk of an explosion. DeWine, quoting from a prepared statement, said inhaling the chemicals could be deadly and anyone who stays in the immediate surroundings is “facing grave danger of death.”

 

[Rover]

Officials conduct a controlled release of a highly-flammable chemical on the train in the hopes of avoiding a massive explosion.

 

[NE933]

I think it's time to put pressure to stop freight from being 140 cars long, especially when they are carrying flammables and toxins.

 

[Old MM]

The carcinogens, particulate matter and other health risks to that area aren’t going away any time soon.

 

[BlackDiamond]

I think it's time to put pressure to stop freight from being 140 cars long, especially when they are carrying flammables and toxins.

While it is true that the longer the train, the more likely it is that a malfunction in say a car's braking system might cause an incident, it might be premature to assume something in the train is responsible. Once the immediate hazard is under control the NTSB will have to get in there and determine the cause. Could be broken rail, any number of things.

 

[MARC Rider]

Officials conduct a controlled release of a highly-flammable chemical on the train in the hopes of avoiding a massive explosion.

In addition to the information about the wreck, I did learn from this broadcast that the name of the town where is happened (East Palestine) is pronounced as "Palesteen."

 

[John819]

The hazmat cleanup will take several days. Then NS can clear the site and start track work to restore service.

 

[railpost]

It is 2/07/23 the day after the controlled "burn" of the toxic chemical from five of the cars of the derailed train and is there any word as to when the track will be cleared and Amtrak service will be resumed through East Palestine Ohio. Will they be able to start work on the site today or is it still determined to be "unsafe"?

 

[AmtrakBlue]

http://www.nscorp.com/content/nscorp/en/service-alerts/derailment-in-east-palestine--oh.html

 

[joelkfla]

While it is true that the longer the train, the more likely it is that a malfunction in say a car's braking system might cause an incident, it might be premature to assume something in the train is responsible. Once the immediate hazard is under control the NTSB will have to get in there and determine the cause. Could be broken rail, any number of things.

While it's not confirmed, there was at least one social media video of a small fire under one of the cars prior to the derailment (hot box?), and the NTSB people did say in their last news conference that there were preliminary indications of a possible mechanical failure. I don't recall the exact wording, but it was very waffley.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

While it's not confirmed, there was at least one social media video of a small fire under one of the cars prior to the derailment (hot box?), and the NTSB people did say in their last news conference that there were preliminary indications of a possible mechanical failure. I don't recall the exact wording, but it was very waffley.

Something to do with an axle

 

[jis]

Something to do with an axle

"Hot Box" would be something to do with an axle since it refers to what amount to a broken bearing, which causes the axle to overheat and then the bearing mount to disintegrate unless the train stops before that comes to pass, causing a derailment.

This is relatively unusual in properly inspected roller bearings these days, but was much more common in pre-roller bearing times with the friction bearings that were lubricated using grease and cotton waste, which tended to catch fire if something went wrong. I remember back in the days trains were carefully inspected for such at each major stop back in India. Each axle was checked. Nothing of the sort is done with roller bearings. They are checked once a day typically.

 

[Septa9739]

Since this seems like it’s going to take a while before 29/30 resume service (School isn’t resuming until at least Monday. I doubt train service before then), and in light of equipment complexities, would it be possible/helpful to run a section of Amfleet I’s NYP to ALB as trains 348/349 that way more seats would in theory be available to rebook people Chicago to the NEC?

 

[jpakala]

Rerouting was so doable decades ago. I remember on IC's 'Land O-Corn' (a Chicago to Waterloo, IA train) when a freight derailment near Jessup, IA caused us to be rerouted via Oelwein, a Chicago Great Western hub. Sadly the only track to Oelwein today is from Waterloo, with nothing in Oelwein toward the NNW (Minneapolis), ESE, etc. East Palestine, OH was on the PA RR's mainline to Chicago and wide owing to multiple tracks. Plenty of lines and plenty of tracks and dozens of RRs was the situation. Watertown, SD had at least four RRS and more tracks (like spokes on a wheel) with C&NW, CRI&P, GN, and Minneapolis & St. Louis lines from numerous directions. All had passenger train service, though that gradually waned, so by the 50s little remained though the tracks were handling freight (I rode in the caboose part way on the Watertown to Sioux Falls line, only the southern piece of which is still in place today). I remember seeing the Wentworth, SD "union" depot where my mother in the 1920s changed trains from the GN to the CMSP&P to reach summer school in Madison, SD.

 

[railiner]

I

"Hot Box" would be something to do with an axle since it refers to what amount to a broken bearing, which causes the axle to overheat and then the bearing mount to disintegrate unless the train stops before that comes to pass, causing a derailment.

This is relatively unusual in properly inspected roller bearings these days, but was much more common in pre-roller bearing times with the friction bearings that were lubricated using grease and cotton waste, which tended to catch fire if something went wrong. I remember back in the days trains were carefully inspected for such at each major stop back in India. Each axle was checked. Nothing of the sort is done with roller bearings. They are checked once a day typically.

I had thought that they had trackside detectors that measured temperature in addition to dragging equipment?

 

[joelkfla]

I had thought that they had trackside detectors that measured temperature in addition to dragging equipment?

IIRC, the NTSB also said there was a positive indication from a defect detector shortly before the incident. And they said an emergency brake application was "initiated". They're very careful about not revealing details before the investigation, so there was no timeline given, and it wasn't said whether the brake application was "initiated" by the crew or by some other means. At the the time, they had retrieved the cab data and video recorders, but it sounded like they hadn't been analyzed yet.