Greyhound seats and fleet questions
- Thread starter Swadian Hardcore
- Start date
Help Support Amtrak Unlimited Discussion Forum:
Swadian Hardcore
Engineer
It's not compared based on size, but on the capability of the vehicle within its class. The position of the X3-45 in the bus industry compares to the A330-300 in the airline industry. If there were a X3-40 with the same fuel capacity, that would be the A330-200. The timeline, operational history, and advancement of technology for their respective industries is also taken into account.
So the 102DL3 is the 747-400, the G4500 is perhaps the 777-300, the H3-45 is the A340-600, etc. Unfortunately, the D4505 doesn't compare to anything except perhaps an Il-96-400.
BTW, how come US bus lines don't expand into Mexico? Mexican bus lines are coming here, but we're not going there.
So the 102DL3 is the 747-400, the G4500 is perhaps the 777-300, the H3-45 is the A340-600, etc. Unfortunately, the D4505 doesn't compare to anything except perhaps an Il-96-400.
BTW, how come US bus lines don't expand into Mexico? Mexican bus lines are coming here, but we're not going there.
Last edited by a moderator:
I don't know much about that....do you suppose driver's wages might have something to do with it?
The reason has to do with treaties and trade agreements between the US and Mexico, especially the North American Trade Agreement between the US,Canada and Mexico started by Bush 41 and signed by Clinton in the 90s.
As most here know, it's taking years just to complete a deal with Canada in regards to doing Customs and Immigration in Montreal Central Station for the Adirondack and with the current Immigration hysteria raging in the land dont look for any foreign agreements between the US and Mexico to be finalized any time soon!
As most here know, it's taking years just to complete a deal with Canada in regards to doing Customs and Immigration in Montreal Central Station for the Adirondack and with the current Immigration hysteria raging in the land dont look for any foreign agreements between the US and Mexico to be finalized any time soon!
Last edited by a moderator:
rickycourtney
Conductor
Greyhound must have been bleeding red ink maintaining their "white elephant", with the current level of service. The old Pacific Greyhound terminal dates back to when Greyhound buses were in and out of there like proverbial streetcars, around the clock. Those days are gone with the wind, so moving in with Amtrak is a no-brainer...
rickycourtney
Conductor
While it reflects the overall shrinking of Greyhound... it is a better station for passengers.
The old station in Fresno was 30,000 square feet and included a restaurant, a driver training facility and a 20 person dorm. The new station is just 2,500 square feet and has none of those amenities. The good news is that the new station is in a much safer area, with nearby businesses that will be popular with riders (including resturants and a convenience store) and is better connected to the transit system in Fresno (which is rather limited).
Swadian Hardcore
Engineer
I saw this photos on Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/thetransitcamera/15194626808/.
That doesn't look like any Greyhound interior to me. It's not a MCI, nor is it a Prevost, and it's not a Setra or Van Hool either. Does anybody know what bus model that is?
Also in the news, New Flyer has finalized their purchase of MCI: http://www.mcicoach.com/media-center/2015-12-18-new-flyer.pdf.
That doesn't look like any Greyhound interior to me. It's not a MCI, nor is it a Prevost, and it's not a Setra or Van Hool either. Does anybody know what bus model that is?
Also in the news, New Flyer has finalized their purchase of MCI: http://www.mcicoach.com/media-center/2015-12-18-new-flyer.pdf.
rickycourtney
Conductor
Agreed. New Flyer is a solid company. I'm excited to see what they can do with MCI.
Swadian Hardcore
Engineer
I'm hoping that the D4505 is axed and the D4500CT is officially turned into a dedicated commuter coach while a new clean-sheet design capable of replacing the 102DL3 and J4500 is introduced, without the option of later being used for commuter service.
Back in the GMC days, there was the Parlour series for the private sector and the New Look series for the public sector. It's not a coincidence that those were the greatest days of the bus industry. Heck, I wish the D4500CT would get axed too, but NJT just had to order so many of them. That wouldn't have been so bad if the G4500 had worked like it was supposed to, but we all know it didn't.
BTW, does anyone know what bus interior that is in the picture? The photographer seems to be another hippie backpacker with kein knowledge.
Back in the GMC days, there was the Parlour series for the private sector and the New Look series for the public sector. It's not a coincidence that those were the greatest days of the bus industry. Heck, I wish the D4500CT would get axed too, but NJT just had to order so many of them. That wouldn't have been so bad if the G4500 had worked like it was supposed to, but we all know it didn't.
BTW, does anyone know what bus interior that is in the picture? The photographer seems to be another hippie backpacker with kein knowledge.
Swadian Hardcore
Engineer
Uh, you mean the link to the MCI press release? That seems to work fine.
Anyway, the Reno-Denver is only running Reno-Salt Lake City or Reno-Steamboat Springs these days. I don't know if this is because of the holiday travel season or because Greyhound is looking to cut more service in the West. Perhaps Greyhound would like to cut Reno-Denver too, if that wouldn't leave another big gap in their network?
Blue G #7270 came here, as well as some X3-45s.
Anyway, the Reno-Denver is only running Reno-Salt Lake City or Reno-Steamboat Springs these days. I don't know if this is because of the holiday travel season or because Greyhound is looking to cut more service in the West. Perhaps Greyhound would like to cut Reno-Denver too, if that wouldn't leave another big gap in their network?
Blue G #7270 came here, as well as some X3-45s.
rickycourtney
Conductor
I feel like one of the first things New Flyer should do is come up with a clean sheet design for a commuter coach.
In my opinion the current offerings leave much to be desired.
The D4500CT has a comfortable ride and can pack in a lot of high back seats. But there are some big downsides to using the D4500CT, mainly that it has a single, narrow door and very high floors making boarding slow and making it ill suited for any route where passengers need to both board and exit at the same stop. The layout also means loading wheelchairs takes a huge amount of time.
The Xcelsior in the suburban configuration is much better for situations where passengers board and exit mid-route. With low floors passengers board faster and loading wheelchairs is quick. But they're aren't terribly comfortable, they have too many awkward seats (aisle facing or low back) and the ride is lousy.
There has to be some sort of a Goldilocks configuration between these two models, that offers a lot of high back seats, at least two doors and either has low floors or is a more standard high floor.
In my opinion the current offerings leave much to be desired.
The D4500CT has a comfortable ride and can pack in a lot of high back seats. But there are some big downsides to using the D4500CT, mainly that it has a single, narrow door and very high floors making boarding slow and making it ill suited for any route where passengers need to both board and exit at the same stop. The layout also means loading wheelchairs takes a huge amount of time.
The Xcelsior in the suburban configuration is much better for situations where passengers board and exit mid-route. With low floors passengers board faster and loading wheelchairs is quick. But they're aren't terribly comfortable, they have too many awkward seats (aisle facing or low back) and the ride is lousy.
There has to be some sort of a Goldilocks configuration between these two models, that offers a lot of high back seats, at least two doors and either has low floors or is a more standard high floor.
Swadian Hardcore
Engineer
I wish New Flyer would do that, as that would eliminate the need for the D4500CT (thereby also killing the D4505), but they already failed with the D45S Viking and NJT continues to order hoards of D4500CTs. They might not be interested in developing a new commuter coach, which indirectly means Prevost will continued to eat up their private sector sales.
I was hoping NJT would order something else, forcing New Flyer-MCI to design a new dedicated commuter coach to replace the D4500CT and D4505. Then MCI could make a J4500 version with the G4500's long wheelbase (J4505?) that would counter the X3-45, leading to a lineup of New Commuter Coach (K4500?), New Intercity Coach (J4505?), and the best-selling Charters & Tours Coach (J4500).
But at this point, I guess MCI could make a J4505 to replace the D4505, but they probably won't make a new commuter coach.
As for a better commuter design, I think New Flyer could combine the D40HF with the D40LF. It would have a small low-floor section at the front for easy boarding and a long high-floor section throughout the rest of the bus. Boarding would be easy and there would be a wheelchair ramp rather than a lift. The low-floor segment at the front would have the standard double wheelchair positions and fold-up seats. All the rest of the bus would be classic high-floor.
Speaking of wheelchair lifts, I discovered this silversides 102DL3 with a rear-mounted lift: http://www.cariboucoach.ca/private_page.php?id=19.
I was hoping NJT would order something else, forcing New Flyer-MCI to design a new dedicated commuter coach to replace the D4500CT and D4505. Then MCI could make a J4500 version with the G4500's long wheelbase (J4505?) that would counter the X3-45, leading to a lineup of New Commuter Coach (K4500?), New Intercity Coach (J4505?), and the best-selling Charters & Tours Coach (J4500).
But at this point, I guess MCI could make a J4505 to replace the D4505, but they probably won't make a new commuter coach.
As for a better commuter design, I think New Flyer could combine the D40HF with the D40LF. It would have a small low-floor section at the front for easy boarding and a long high-floor section throughout the rest of the bus. Boarding would be easy and there would be a wheelchair ramp rather than a lift. The low-floor segment at the front would have the standard double wheelchair positions and fold-up seats. All the rest of the bus would be classic high-floor.
Speaking of wheelchair lifts, I discovered this silversides 102DL3 with a rear-mounted lift: http://www.cariboucoach.ca/private_page.php?id=19.
No, not the press release....thought you were referring to the first link....the Flickr photo.....
rickycourtney
Conductor
I HIGHLY doubt that New Flyer would stop sales of commuter coaches. In fact I'm reasonably sure that getting into commuter coach sales was exactly why New Flyer purchased MCI. It's a big part of the transit industry that New Flyer had no part in.
One of the things that New Flyer did when they designed the Xcelsior was they looked at the interior first and then built the rest of the bus. By tweaking the placement of the rear axle they squeezed 19 seats into the rear high floor section and only two are transverse (aisle facing) seats, compared to 15 seats/6 transverse on the old LF series. They also adjusted the size of the rear platform to increase headroom, eliminate the transverse seats near the rear door and curved the steps up to the high floor section to encourage passengers to exit from the rear door.
If they take the same sort of passenger-first approach to a commuter coach, I'm sure they can come up with something great.
I mean, there's a lot of ways to tweak the design. You can definitely make the coach 45 feet (since most commuter coaches are already 45 footers) there should be a good way to add a rear door to the design and since it goes unused in commuter coaches, you can definitely eliminate the baggage storage compartments.
One of the things that New Flyer did when they designed the Xcelsior was they looked at the interior first and then built the rest of the bus. By tweaking the placement of the rear axle they squeezed 19 seats into the rear high floor section and only two are transverse (aisle facing) seats, compared to 15 seats/6 transverse on the old LF series. They also adjusted the size of the rear platform to increase headroom, eliminate the transverse seats near the rear door and curved the steps up to the high floor section to encourage passengers to exit from the rear door.
If they take the same sort of passenger-first approach to a commuter coach, I'm sure they can come up with something great.
I mean, there's a lot of ways to tweak the design. You can definitely make the coach 45 feet (since most commuter coaches are already 45 footers) there should be a good way to add a rear door to the design and since it goes unused in commuter coaches, you can definitely eliminate the baggage storage compartments.
Swadian Hardcore
Engineer
Ooops, that Flickr picture was a mistake. Sorry.
This is the one I was referring to: https://www.flickr.com/photos/yinyangphotos/23877254355.
That interior has a curved headliner, like a MCI, but the parcel racks definitely aren't MCI and the window mullions don't look like MCI either. I checked Dina interior and they're Dina. Definitely not Van Hool, Setra, or Prevost either.
So, I don't know what it could be.
This is the one I was referring to: https://www.flickr.com/photos/yinyangphotos/23877254355.
That interior has a curved headliner, like a MCI, but the parcel racks definitely aren't MCI and the window mullions don't look like MCI either. I checked Dina interior and they're Dina. Definitely not Van Hool, Setra, or Prevost either.
So, I don't know what it could be.
Swadian Hardcore
Engineer
I think that's it! I forgot that the MC-9 has different parcel racks from the MC-12 (which has 96A3 parcel racks) though I believe the MC-9SP has 96A3 parcel racks too.
How the heck he got to ride on a Greyhound MC-9? AFAIK those have been long gone. The photo isn't dated and he must think I'm a stupid fool for asking him the bus model.
BTW, those two guys meet my definition of "degenerate", lol!
How the heck he got to ride on a Greyhound MC-9? AFAIK those have been long gone. The photo isn't dated and he must think I'm a stupid fool for asking him the bus model.
BTW, those two guys meet my definition of "degenerate", lol!
Swadian Hardcore
Engineer
He did upload this "1980" photo: https://www.flickr.com/photos/yinyangphotos/23775238411/.
I don't understand why he took a self-portrait of himself looking stupid, but OK.
Hey, DL3 #30986 was here in Reno yesterday, and to my surprise it left on the last run to San Francisco rather than heading back east. The Reno-Denver is still only running Reno-Salt Lake City. Those passengers along US 40 are going to be pissed unless Greyhound refunded all their tickets. I think Greyhound is about to discontinue that segment. #UT86398, which used to be a regular on the Reno-Denver, is doing the Portland-Los Angeles today.
I don't understand why he took a self-portrait of himself looking stupid, but OK.
Hey, DL3 #30986 was here in Reno yesterday, and to my surprise it left on the last run to San Francisco rather than heading back east. The Reno-Denver is still only running Reno-Salt Lake City. Those passengers along US 40 are going to be pissed unless Greyhound refunded all their tickets. I think Greyhound is about to discontinue that segment. #UT86398, which used to be a regular on the Reno-Denver, is doing the Portland-Los Angeles today.
Swadian Hardcore
Engineer
Does anyone know the actual floor space of the 102DL3? I know the exterior is 102" wide but the interior looks to be more like 98" or 96" because the dual-layer sidewalls are pretty thick. Interior length is probably about 442" (13x34"), but there's a lot of inconsistent legroom seats. How much is the actual space available?
Also, GLC appears to have removed the TVs from their DL3s with the rebuilds. They were pretty silly anyway. But GLI bought some second-hand DL3s and rebuilt them without removing the TVs. Instead, they just covered up the screens. How hard is it to remove the TVs?
Also, GLC appears to have removed the TVs from their DL3s with the rebuilds. They were pretty silly anyway. But GLI bought some second-hand DL3s and rebuilt them without removing the TVs. Instead, they just covered up the screens. How hard is it to remove the TVs?
Latest posts
-
-
St. Paul, Milwaukee, Chicago Corridor service H2 2024
- Latest: Metra Electric Rider
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
