Greyhound seats and fleet questions

[railiner]

If you ever notice, the first choice of entertainer's, and other's owning top level motorhome conversions has been the Prevost XL for quite some time. These folks literally live in these million-dollar rolling palaces, so they are very demanding, and the Prevost is their favorite. They even make a special edition of the XL for conversions, with a raised roof, that ends up being as tall as an H3....

I got a chance to see NASCAR favorite Jeff Gordon's coach a few years ago, while it was getting factory service at the Prevost dealer in New Jersey. Unbelievable inside!

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

If you ever notice, the first choice of entertainer's, and other's owning top level motorhome conversions has been the Prevost XL for quite some time. These folks literally live in these million-dollar rolling palaces, so they are very demanding, and the Prevost is their favorite. They even make a special edition of the XL for conversions, with a raised roof, that ends up being as tall as an H3....I got a chance to see NASCAR favorite Jeff Gordon's coach a few years ago, while it was getting factory service at the Prevost dealer in New Jersey. Unbelievable inside!

Yes, I noticed that. I thought that the H3-45 would be a better option. Is the conversion XL that you mention derived from the LeMirage series or the X3-45? I though the XL-II was a version of the LeMirage? This gets even more confusion because one could argue that the X3-45 is derived from the original LeMirage.

I'm sure weathy folks prefer a faast bus over slower ones, so does that mean the Prevost X is the fastest coach available? I think it would be the X or the MCI D for the speed trophy because all the other coaches seem too tall or unstable to run fast.

 

[railiner]

Even the President travels in a luxury Prevost conversion for certain events. There was controversy when it won out competition for the honor over the MCI 'J', because it wasn't 'American made'. Well the MCI has Canadian origins as well, but I suppose more of it is made here than the Prevost....

The Secret Service made the selection based on certain undisclosed features of the Prevost construction, that they said made it easier to 'fortify' for the mission....

The Prevost catalog lists the H3-45 and the X-3 for bus use. It lists the H3-45VIP, the X3-45VIP and the XLII. for motorhome conversions or 'entertainer' coaches. I can't see the difference between the last two in the specs, although the XLII bus version , replaced by the X-3 had a shorter wheelbase than the X-3. The conversion XLII seems to have the longer wheelbase of the X-3. You are correct...the X-3 was derived from the XLII, which did bear the moniker LeMirage XL previously, And before that was the 40 foot LeMirage, and a long line of 40 footers going way back.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Even the President travels in a luxury Prevost conversion for certain events. There was controversy when it won out competition for the honor over the MCI 'J', because it wasn't 'American made'. Well the MCI has Canadian origins as well, but I suppose more of it is made here than the Prevost....The Secret Service made the selection based on certain undisclosed features of the Prevost construction, that they said made it easier to 'fortify' for the mission....

The Prevost catalog lists the H3-45 and the X-3 for bus use. It lists the H3-45VIP, the X3-45VIP and the XLII. for motorhome conversions or 'entertainer' coaches. I can't see the difference between the last two in the specs, although the XLII bus version , replaced by the X-3 had a shorter wheelbase than the X-3. The conversion XLII seems to have the longer wheelbase of the X-3. You are correct...the X-3 was derived from the XLII, which did bear the moniker LeMirage XL previously, And before that was the 40 foot LeMirage, and a long line of 40 footers going way back.

MCI used to be confusing with their D, E, F, G, and J at the same time in 2001, but now Prevost models are all messed up with all these derivatives and versions! The H3-45 even got shortened from the original H3-60! Prevost looks like it can't design an original coach right, but after some modifications, they become great succeses!

I think the flatter parts of the Prevost H3-45 might have made it easier to armour then the rounded-nose J4500. I'm not a Prevost hater, their H3 products are pretty good because of their high capacity and decent other features. X3 is a smooth, effieciient SD coach, too, despite the luggage problems. I'm just a MCI fan, and as you know, Eagles never get along with Giants!

BTW, I would still like to know the fastest intercity bus in service, since there's talk about fast planes, trains, and automobiles all the time, and it's about time the bus gets some attention, too!

 

[railiner]

Top end speed is limited in carrier fleets to approximately 72-73 mph by road speed governors. Occasionally you may find one that will exceed that. Motorhome conversion's often are not limited as severely, and are quite capable of 80+ mph....

Off-the-line, the Allison automatics will leave any 'automated manual' (like a ZFastronic or Volvo I-drive) in the dust. In the mountains though, the multi-speed automated manuals have the advantage with up to 12 speeds to choose from as opposed to the 6 speed Allison.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

I know about the governers, I've ridden some units with 75 mph governers, that's about the highest I know of. Why do some units get governed at 72 mph, when no speed limit is actually that?

Since my relocation, I've been riding the G4500 a lot more and it's been easier to compile information about them. I might post some info when I can confirm their accuracy.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

I just got the latest rumour in the bus industry: Greyhound will remove all G4500 units from California after refurbishment due to California Emission Standards.

Now, how are they supposed to do this when at least 100 of these buses operate in California? And why after refurbs, when they could get a new engine?

Anyone know about this? I can't log on to Greyhound Through Express, so I'm just saying it here.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Just did some spotting at GLI-RNO. Saw four G4500 units, nothing else. Numbers 7234, 7238, 7241, and 7280. This just dosen't seem right, I've been so accustomed to DL3s, and now I can't find any! All these four were running Route 540 to SFD. They were all in Road Rainbow. 7234 and 7280 was heaviliy beat up. Not a great situation.

None of these were refurbished. Some still had the original blue rear end. I might post the details of each bus later.

 

[railiner]

Keep those 'G'unkers out your way, please.....the few we see are a few too many......

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Keep those 'G'unkers out your way, please.....the few we see are a few too many......

They're still no match for a Junkers! :huh: This is a bas situation with hugely high Amtrak fares and terrible Greyhound buses! Not a D in sight, it's just Gunk, Gunk, and more Gunk! :blush:

Edit: Just thought I would tell you about 7280. This thing had a HUGE 6-foot-long horizontal tear in the right side main panel, right where the passengers sit. It was covered with a crazy load of duct tape. Looking down, the right baggage hatches for Compartments 1 and 3 had both detached and were replaced with plain white hatches that stood out as gaps in the Road Rainbow. In the front, part of the bumper was also damaged. Distination sign was totally gone, it wasn't just broken, it was GONE!

BUT, the left side looked almost perfect! You could never realize this horrible piece of Gunk without coming to the right. Anyways, I couldn't see the back, since I was strolling around the loading area and the bus was nosed in to Gate 2.

Now there's my report, sire!

 

[railiner]

Yep....'G's should all come with baling wire, zip ties, and duct tape as standard equipment.....

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Yep....'G's should all come with baling wire, zip ties, and duct tape as standard equipment.....

Ha, yes! Looks like Greyhound isn't too happy at California or the West in general. I think that story about California Emission Standards is total bogus, how is Greyhound supposed to remove scores of G4500s holding down all service in the area? Too bad that CA dosen't care about Greyhound, in their transport maps they mention everybody except Greyhound!

At least the runs east of here to SLC and Denver are still D-exclusive. I just didn't see any last time because they were parked up in the garage that was locked up.

Situation is pretty bad in other terms, lots of smoke everywhere around and a huge sinkhole in the middle of I-80 dosen't help either. I don't know what Greyhound's doing right now, maybe using Beckworth Pass. No service alert right now.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Why did Greyhound switch from the old reliable 4-digit unit numbers to the new 5-digit 86000 numbers? Makes no sense, just like the new planes going with -8, -9, and -10 instead of the old -100, -200, and -300.

 

[railiner]

Why did Greyhound switch from the old reliable 4-digit unit numbers to the new 5-digit 86000 numbers? Makes no sense, just like the new planes going with -8, -9, and -10 instead of the old -100, -200, and -300.

That's a good question.....back in the good ole days, of GL, they had 6,000 coaches in their fleet, and did very nicely with four digit numbers. Now they are only about a third of their former size, and they have added those five digit numbers...... :huh:

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Why did Greyhound switch from the old reliable 4-digit unit numbers to the new 5-digit 86000 numbers? Makes no sense, just like the new planes going with -8, -9, and -10 instead of the old -100, -200, and -300.

That's a good question.....back in the good ole days, of GL, they had 6,000 coaches in their fleet, and did very nicely with four digit numbers. Now they are only about a third of their former size, and they have added those five digit numbers...... :huh:

I know right? It dosen't make sense. According to the DOT, Greyhound Lines only operates 1,323 units now. Sure, a fair bit more would come with the new order, but it's still nowhere near enough to justify a 5-digit number.

I never saw those days of 6,000 Greyhounds running on the road. By the time I was born, they were down to around 4,000.

I think the largest bus fleet under a single operator is 28,000 units operated by Beijing Public Transit. Could be others, but of course BPT needs 5-digit numbers!

 

[railiner]

Our combined fleet of about 150 buses also have five digit numbers---simply a carryover from the Continental Trailways-National Trailways days when the first two digits were used to identify the company....the 85,000 series GL buses are also part of that carryover, the '85' identifying them as former Carolina Trailways buses......

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Our combined fleet of about 150 buses also have five digit numbers---simply a carryover from the Continental Trailways-National Trailways days when the first two digits were used to identify the company....the 85,000 series GL buses are also part of that carryover, the '85' identifying them as former Carolina Trailways buses......

I can understand using 5-numbers for subsidiaries, like 30000 for TNM&O, 40000 for Vermont Transit, or 60000 for Americanos, but now all the new buses are 86000s, which is quite pointless.

For that matter, I managed to ride 52672 a few months ago, that DL3 used to be operated by Golden State Lines and no bus fans has spotted it in twelve years! Feels just like any other refurbished DL3. I heard it had a different engine, a Version P instead of Greyhound's standard Version R, but I'm not sure if it got the R engine after so many years.

I don't know the power ratings of these two engines, do you know?

 

[railiner]

To continue from the other thread......PD4104's, '06's, '07's.....all had optional power steering. The Eagles were later offered with power steering, as well.

There is no longer bus service across "The Loneliest Road in America"--Nevada US-50.....

I have driven it, and it was more desolate than even the AlCan Highway....We went over 100 miles on one stretch, and did not meet a single vehicle coming the other way!

Cell phones were useless. You could not even pick up a broadcast station on the radio. Only satellite communications would work out there...There were ample warning signs to be sure your vehicle was prepared to go 100 or more miles with no services available.

 

[railiner]

Our combined fleet of about 150 buses also have five digit numbers---simply a carryover from the Continental Trailways-National Trailways days when the first two digits were used to identify the company....the 85,000 series GL buses are also part of that carryover, the '85' identifying them as former Carolina Trailways buses......

I can understand using 5-numbers for subsidiaries, like 30000 for TNM&O, 40000 for Vermont Transit, or 60000 for Americanos, but now all the new buses are 86000s, which is quite pointless.

For that matter, I managed to ride 52672 a few months ago, that DL3 used to be operated by Golden State Lines and no bus fans has spotted it in twelve years! Feels just like any other refurbished DL3. I heard it had a different engine, a Version P instead of Greyhound's standard Version R, but I'm not sure if it got the R engine after so many years.

I don't know the power ratings of these two engines, do you know?

Do not, sorry....the only difference in our old 'D's, was some had the Detroit 60 series, and some had CAT's......the Detroit's were better for buses.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

To continue from the other thread......PD4104's, '06's, '07's.....all had optional power steering. The Eagles were later offered with power steering, as well.
There is no longer bus service across "The Loneliest Road in America"--Nevada US-50.....

I have driven it, and it was more desolate than even the AlCan Highway....We went over 100 miles on one stretch, and did not meet a single vehicle coming the other way!

Cell phones were useless. You could not even pick up a broadcast station on the radio. Only satellite communications would work out there...There were ample warning signs to be sure your vehicle was prepared to go 100 or more miles with no services available.

You know, you can cross-quote from another thread with the "Multi-Quote" option. I remeber accdently making that mistake on another thread and ended up having to edit it out.

I'm pretty that road is the loneliest in America. It's basically nothing at all from Fallon to Ely, with some tiny towns like Austin. Could be great if you want to see a desert sunset, but it's probably very dangerous to get stranded there overnight unless you're prepared to survive. Would be good for a Man vs. Wild episode, despite all its faked parts.

Our combined fleet of about 150 buses also have five digit numbers---simply a carryover from the Continental Trailways-National Trailways days when the first two digits were used to identify the company....the 85,000 series GL buses are also part of that carryover, the '85' identifying them as former Carolina Trailways buses......

I can understand using 5-numbers for subsidiaries, like 30000 for TNM&O, 40000 for Vermont Transit, or 60000 for Americanos, but now all the new buses are 86000s, which is quite pointless.

For that matter, I managed to ride 52672 a few months ago, that DL3 used to be operated by Golden State Lines and no bus fans has spotted it in twelve years! Feels just like any other refurbished DL3. I heard it had a different engine, a Version P instead of Greyhound's standard Version R, but I'm not sure if it got the R engine after so many years.

I don't know the power ratings of these two engines, do you know?

Do not, sorry....the only difference in our old 'D's, was some had the Detroit 60 series, and some had CAT's......the Detroit's were better for buses.

Ah, that's too bad. I'll have to ask a mechanic unless the drivers know. The nearest Maintainence Center is Los Angeles, 500 miles away, so it's not easy to ask right now. I wish I could log on to Greyhound Through Express (the forum) but it dosen't seem to work for some reason.

I don't think MCI still offers any Detroit Diesels in their current D4505. Not very familiar with the Cummins ISX. Seems to offer good power at least, 425 hp is good compared to those teeny ISL with only 330 hp.

All I found from a search was this: http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f19/detroit-diesels-series-60-r-rates-no-2-10-best-diesel-engines-ever-list-34955/. it sure feels like a good engine, the DL3 runs really smooth with them.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Also, DesignLine just filed for bankruptcy: http://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2013/08/16/charlotte-hybrid-busmaker-designline.html.

Don't know what NJT is going to buy now. Maybe they could try out the X3-45 Commuter or a New Flyer Industries deisgn. NFI has been known to make good transit buses, so maybe they can enter the intercity market. Greyhound needs all the buses it can get, and I would much rather them buy good New Flyers than the Van Hools. NFI is turning into a powerhouse by buying NABI. That basically secures the Los Angeles, Phoenix, and Miami transit markets.

 

[railiner]

Funny if New Flyer goes into the coach market. After all, their predecessor, Western Flyer, started as a coach builder, then ceased building coaches and switched to building transit buses around 1967......

 

[CHamilton]

FYI, New Flyer recently won the contract to build electric trolley buses for Seattle and MUNI.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Isn't New Flyer the only Buy America company that still build trackless trolleys? Gillig dosen't seem to build them anymore and the other ones have all gone bankrupt or stopped building buses altogether.

New Flyer sure has a monopoly, they better watch out for the trust-breakers. Orion was terrible, I'm glad they're done for.

 

[CHamilton]

Isn't New Flyer the only Buy America company that still build trackless trolleys? Gillig dosen't seem to build them anymore and the other ones have all gone bankrupt or stopped building buses altogether.

I haven't been able to find any information about who else was in the running for the Seattle procurement, but I'm pretty sure they had some other bidders.

Orion was terrible, I'm glad they're done for.

Why do you say that? From a passenger standpoint, the Orion hybrids are pretty comfortable, and the drivers I've talked to love them.