Is the Acela worth 2.5X the price to save 10 minutes?

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dlagrua

dlagrua

Engineer
AU Supporting Member
Joined
Nov 24, 2009
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Location
Hillsborough, NJ
My wife and myself are going to Washington DC on March 12th to see a special National Geographic Museum exhibit from China. We were considering taking the Acela from PHL. After checking the fares, the Acela was $113.00 each way and the Metro service was only $46.00. That means that if we took the Acela the cost for the two of us would be an additional $134.00 extra each way (or $268 for the trip). I know that the Acela is a nicer train as I've ridden it before but the time savings was only 10 minutes; 1hr 40min vs 1 hr 50min. Heck even if we saved an hour in travel time the Acela might not be worth taking.

For a short trip and only a 10 minute savings in travel time it seemed to make sense to save $268.00 and arrive only 10 minutes later.

How does Amtrak justify the huge difference in price? I can see paying 20% more but two and one half times the price? Does anyone believe that the Acela is worth taking for only a 10 minute savings?
 
Personally I agree with you that it's not worth it. And many people also feel the same way. Some feel that if the company or client is paying, they will take AE. But if they (themselves) pay, they'll take a Regional.

Between certain cities, it makes some sense. For example, NYP-BOS is a select city pair and earns 500 AGR points for BC or 750 AGR points for AE First! :) NYP-PVD is not and just earns 2 AGR points per $. So for one you earn 500 points, the other one earns less than 200 points. :(
 
While I would not pay that much... I don't think Amtrak has to justify it, if they are getting the money and the trains are running at reasonable capacity, thats all the justification they need. The Acela is supposed to be a premium service, so it comes at a premium price tag. The fact that Amtrak makes it more appealing for AGR members and others to ride on select city routes also shows that Amtrak wants to support certain city pairs for the Acela, something which makes sense from a business stand point.
 
is a first-class airline ticket worth twice the price for the exact same travel time as coach?
 
IMO Acela is worth it when on biz travel and the company (ie taxpayers)pay for it, if more than a couple of hours the FC upgrade is nice for the meals and drinks but biz class is nice enough.Otherwise it is overpriced if a short trip! As a Senior you can travel on weekends for a 15%discount, and if Select or above you get the upgrade coupons which make a trip worth it when Regionals arent discounted or take all day since some make so many stops! First class air fare is the biggest rip off in commerce, it's a vestige of when the Robber Barons ruled the world and had their own railcars/railroads and traveled in Royal style aboard steamships! That being said it sure is nice on long flights across the pond! ;) :D :lol:
 
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Keep in mind also that $46 is the low bucket fare for the Regionals between Philly & DC, $113 is at least the second bucket price for Acela between the same two cities. That's increasing the difference. While it can't happen between Philly & DC; I have seen cases where between Boston & NY on a weekend when more people tend to take the Regionals, where one can buy a seat on Acela for less money than on certain Regionals.
 
I've even seen fares where the difference between acela and the NEC regional is more than 2.5x - like when there is a low bucket fare from PVD - BOS for $12 and a high bucket $45 acela PVD - BOS. And I think the time difference is 5-10 minutes for that as well!

And considering that both are worth 100 AGR points, I will take the regional :)
 
dlagrua said:
My wife and myself are going to Washington DC on March 12th to see a special National Geographic Museum exhibit from China. We were considering taking the Acela from PHL. After checking the fares, the Acela was $113.00 each way and the Metro service was only $46.00. That means that if we took the Acela the cost for the two of us would be an additional $134.00 extra each way (or $268 for the trip). I know that the Acela is a nicer train as I've ridden it before but the time savings was only 10 minutes; 1hr 40min vs 1 hr 50min. Heck even if we saved an hour in travel time the Acela might not be worth taking.For a short trip and only a 10 minute savings in travel time it seemed to make sense to save $268.00 and arrive only 10 minutes later.

How does Amtrak justify the huge difference in price? I can see paying 20% more but two and one half times the price? Does anyone believe that the Acela is worth taking for only a 10 minute savings?
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$113 vs $46 is a big difference. I used to ride NYP - PVD regularly. Often the price difference was $<20, and that's when I would take Acela. I will admit the Regional service feels much slower than AE when traveling through RI and up to RTE station, but I'm not sure if AE travels that fast south of Philly.

In your scenario, I would take the $268 you saved and stay over in DC at a nice hotel. Hope you have a great trip!
 
the_traveler said:
You can zip thru KIN at 150 MPH - and see some crazy guy there! :lol: So maybe there is a plus side! :D
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I was looking this past Monday and didn't see any crazy guy there. :unsure:

Granted the station isn't much more than a blur at the speed Acela passes through KIN, but still didn't see any crazy guys.
 
Reminds me of those who pay $20 extra for Biz class on the Surfliner between LA and San Diego, when almost every consist includes a Superliner coach for regular coach price! Last week the Santa Barbara=San Diego run included a rebuilt Superliner coach that had just been taken off the CS, given that the new menus were in all the seat pockets! For a minute I had visions of the tiny first-level Surfliner cafe serving the special beef dish of the day instead of a nuked burger!
 
AlanB said:
the_traveler said:
You can zip thru KIN at 150 MPH - and see some crazy guy there! :lol: So maybe there is a plus side! :D
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I was looking this past Monday and didn't see any crazy guy there. :unsure:

Granted the station isn't much more than a blur at the speed Acela passes through KIN, but still didn't see any crazy guys.
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if you blinked then you missed him :blink:
 
AlanB said:
Keep in mind also that $46 is the low bucket fare for the Regionals between Philly & DC, $113 is at least the second bucket price for Acela between the same two cities.
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Also remember one is comparing regional coach against Acela business class.

To even be close to a fair fare comparison, one really should be using regional business class too. :rolleyes:
 
Guest said:
AlanB said:
Keep in mind also that $46 is the low bucket fare for the Regionals between Philly & DC, $113 is at least the second bucket price for Acela between the same two cities.
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Also remember one is comparing regional coach against Acela business class.

To even be close to a fair fare comparison, one really should be using regional business class too. :rolleyes:
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Not necessarily! Regionals have coach and business class, while Acela has only business class and Acela First. So coach is the lower priced choice on Regional and business class is the lower priced choice on Acela.
 
One should also remember that, all other things being equal, the cost/benefit ratio of Acela would increase with the distance travelled. Philly -WAS may not be worth it for 10 minutes. NYP - WAS might well be as you save almost an hour, I believe.
 
George said:
One should also remember that, all other things being equal, the cost/benefit ratio of Acela would increase with the distance travelled. Philly -WAS may not be worth it for 10 minutes. NYP - WAS might well be as you save almost an hour, I believe.
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To be fair, you should compare similar bucket prices as Alan suggested.

Low bucket from Philly to WAS:

Regional: $46

Acela: $97

Not quite double, but I also realize that Regional discounts of 10-20% are easy to come by and normally only have a 3 day advance booking policy. Discounts on the Acela except on weekends are much harder to come by, so it's safe to say that your 2.5X comparison is still probably valid.

For your trip, I might agree, that it isn't worth it to ride Acela, but hear are some other circumstances where riding Acela can be justified.

When riding from Boston to WAS, Acela can save between 60-90 minutes. While that isn't a huge deal for me, a business executive probably can use any time savings of 30 minutes or more to justify the expense.

Acela offers a smoother ride

When riding between Select cities, you can often earn 300 or more AGR points--higher with double point promos--than on a Regional

Lastly, and this can be a big one when the system breaks down, Amtrak will give preference to Acela over other trains on the NEC, when things are running late, so potentially you may have a better chance of actually making a connection when taking an Acela over a regional.

Finally, if you ever have a chance to upgrade from coach to Business on Regional or Business to 1st on Acela, and have to choose.......it's no comparison.

1st on Acela is nice and even nicer when it's free!
 
First and foremost, enjoy those terra cotta warriors..they are truly stunning.

I am not going to even attempt to discuss the business plans of AMTRAK, the ratios, the scenery (which you've already seen), nor will I mention..well OK, I WILL mention it LOL...this reminds me of the many MANY "discussions" I have had with folks about whether or not it is "worth it" to pay for First Class vs Second on some trains in Europe which, as someone has pointed out...arrive pretty much at the same time.

Money is money and IMO if you have this "feeling" that it isn't worth it AND you have the inclination to ask a bunch of strangers..I mean, buddy you probably don't even know how we DRESS so am glad you aren't asking "What should I wear?"...bottom line: if it SEEMS worth it to you then go for it; if it doesn't then don't.

On my two upcoming LD trips I'm springing for bedrooms vs. roomettes...BECAUSE I WANT TO and they seem worth it..in one case it is over $800 vs $300...the whole thing is never easy but please remember it is YOUR money and YOU are the one who is riding and PAYING..not us!

Cheers
 
If the only justification for Acela fares has to be made based on the time saved, then don't waste your time trying to do so. It cannot be justified purely on time saved. OTOH, there are sufficient other reasons in my mind which when taken all together causes me to always travel Acela, irrespective of whether I am paying for it my self or someone else is. If I was that hard up for money I'd take the China Bus as my nephew does all the time. He is a student, like I was back in the 70s, and at that time I did not even touch Amtrak unless someone else was paying. It was the Hound all the way then :)

It is for everyone to choose the level of comfort and ambiance that they are able to or want to afford given their situation. The Acela has found a niche where significant number of people for whatever reason feel like spending the extra money for whatever it brings to the table. If/when that ceases to be the case fares will automatically come down in order to keep the trains reasonably full.
 
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jis said:
If the only justification for Acela fares has to be made based on the time saved, then don't waste your time trying to do so. It cannot be justified purely on time saved. OTOH, there are sufficient other reasons in my mind which when taken all together causes me to always travel Acela, irrespective of whether I am paying for it my self or someone else is. If I was that hard up for money I'd take the China Bus as my nephew does all the time. He is a student, like I was back in the 70s, and at that time I did not even touch Amtrak unless someone else was paying. It was the Hound all the way then :)
It is for everyone to choose the level of comfort and ambiance that they are able to or want to afford given their situation. The Acela has found a niche where significant number of people for whatever reason feel like spending the extra money for whatever it brings to the table. If/when that ceases to be the case fares will automatically come down in order to keep the trains reasonably full.
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Agreeded. for no matter how you feel about the cost of this service based on your own particular view of economics and spending habits, this comes down to service and priorities. The ability for those from the worlds of business and politics to travel on a service with increased comfort, amenities (knowing that there will be an outlet at any seat they take is highly important), a higher travel priority and the likely hood of less interaction with factors and/or personnel (crying babies, traveling groups.etc) which could impede their productivity or comfort is a major plus.

Think what you will about the price but like or not, understand it or not, appreciate it or not at certain business and economic levels productivity and convince is the issue and not cost.

For example I was on 2153 this week with Amtrak handling no less than three recognizable international dignitaries from the worlds of business, politics and the arts and they don’t want to sit next to Jane Doe and the 2 year old asking questions about the stimulus package for the next 3 hours :) .

Sorry, membership has its privileges

Tim
 
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