Lake Shore/Capitol Limited Sleeping Car Menu Refresh 1/16/19

[VTTrain]

Just out of curiosity, are those "or's" non-negotiable dividers or do they offer to mix and match between the three?

From the photos I have seen, you are allowed to mix and match.  

 

[glensfallsse]

Just out of curiosity, are those "or's" non-negotiable dividers or do they offer to mix and match between the three?

I got the hot sandwich AND the fruit. My impression was you could mix in other stuff but I don’t know that for sure. 

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Sounds reasonable for a one-off day trip.  I wouldn't want to see this on any of the major Western routes and I would get tired of it quickly if I rode the CL or LSL on a regular basis, but at least it's moderately workable in a pinch.  Seems better than what happened to the Star, although at least in that case you get the benefit of substantially lower fares.

 

[PerRock]

I came across this link on Facebook.  I have no idea if this is really the new cafe menu.

https://www.amtrak.com/content/dam/projects/dotcom/english/public/documents/menus/routes/Capitol-Limited-Cafe-Menu-0119.pdf?fbclid=IwAR0AqT2ILPbssr_rbG_2C48KBezfruOod60Vq8mAmCrh11SedcfjLB0kuyM

Aw yeees, the Cup of Noodle is back! Best meal on the train for a budget-conscious traveler.

peter

 

[cpotisch]

Was the engine cut off (assuming the Boston section is at the front once it's attached)?  Just verifying if the new diners have back-up battery power.  Spent many dinners in the dark and cold in D.C. during the Meteor engine change southbound.  Some crews gave us glow sticks.

I think they also lost a diner seating due to the engine change at D.C. on the Meteor so the new diners may be more efficient but then again I don't know if the ovens will work on battery power. 

The Viewliner II diners used as "Sleeper Lounges" on the LSL are the exact same as those on the Meteor. And I'm pretty sure they do have backup power.

 

[cpotisch]

Aw yeees, the Cup of Noodle is back! Best meal on the train for a budget-conscious traveler.

peter

Also the best meal in my house at the moment. ^_^

 

[Manny T]

Does anyone remember the story about the farmer who asked the wise man, "Sir, my house is way too small for my wife, my 7 children, and my in-laws. I can't stand it. What should I do?" The wise man said, "Bring all your animals into the house, your pigs, goats, sheep, and chickens." The farmer did it and then returned to the wise man and said, "Sir, the situation is absolutely terrible. I can stand it! What should I do?" The wise man replied, "Take all the animals out of the house." The farmer did it, returned to the wise man and said, "Oh thank you sir for your advice. My life is wonderful now."

Looks like this is what Amtrak did. They reduced food service on the CL/LSL to absolutely rotten levels that many could not tolerate, and some bolted just to avoid (some were fine with it). Then they improved it a little, TV dinners for lunch and dinner, more breakfast choices (but it's still not made-to-order French Toast quality) -- and people are applauding. Isn't life wonderful!

 

[cpotisch]

Does anyone remember the story about the farmer who asked the wise man, "Sir, my house is way too small for my wife, my 7 children, and my in-laws. I can't stand it. What should I do?" The wise man said, "Bring all your animals into the house, your pigs, goats, sheep, and chickens." The farmer did it and then returned to the wise man and said, "Sir, the situation is absolutely terrible. I can stand it! What should I do?" The wise man replied, "Take all the animals out of the house." The farmer did it, returned to the wise man and said, "Oh thank you sir for your advice. My life is wonderful now."

Looks like this is what Amtrak did. They reduced food service on the CL/LSL to absolutely rotten levels that many could not tolerate, and some bolted just to avoid (some were fine with it). Then they improved it a little, TV dinners for lunch and dinner, more breakfast choices (but it's still not made-to-order French Toast quality) -- and people are applauding. Isn't life wonderful!

Seems like a bit of an exaggeration.

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

Looks like this is what Amtrak did. They reduced food service on the CL/LSL to absolutely rotten levels that many could not tolerate, and some bolted just to avoid (some were fine with it). Then they improved it a little, TV dinners for lunch and dinner, more breakfast choices, and people are applauding.

Conspiracy theories can be sometimes explained with simple incompetence.  Not everyone is a Senator Palatine.

Still waiting to see when the coach passengers will be allow to spend money in the dinner.  At some point someone is going ask why this car is exclusive to a handful of elite passengers.  Who many or many not cover the expense of the car.  When all the food preparation can be done in a much smaller space, like a dinette/lounge car.  Not the best use for a brand new dining car.

 

[VTTrain]

While I question the wisdom of having the dining car be exclusively for sleeper car passengers, I’m not sure how many people will ultimately question that decision while they are on the train. It’s not as if people demand first class amenities when they are flying coach on an airplane.   Conceptually, it’s reasonable that people who pay much more for their ticket will receive enhanced benefits in return. 

That said, I would like to see this be opened up to coach passengers. But if they do that I would like the option to pre-order meals as a sleeper car passenger so I am guaranteed to get the meal of my choice.

 

[VTTrain]

I just noticed that the calorie counts are conspicuously absent from the new menu.

 

[cpotisch]

While I question the wisdom of having the dining car be exclusively for sleeper car passengers, I’m not sure how many people will ultimately question that decision while they are on the train. It’s not as if people demand first class amenities when they are flying coach on an airplane.   Conceptually, it’s reasonable that people who pay much more for their ticket will receive enhanced benefits in return. 

That said, I would like to see this be opened up to coach passengers. But if they do that I would like the option to pre-order meals as a sleeper car passenger so I am guaranteed to get the meal of my choice.

Conventional Amtrak dining cars have always served coach passengers, and they managed without any pre-order system. And let's not forget that before contemporary dining, the LSL had one of the highest rates of diner utilization by coach passengers in the Amtrak system (something like 50%). So not only does cutting coach passengers out of the diner alienate the more budget-constrained customers, but it also means that Amtrak is missing out on quite a bit of diner revenue.

I agree that "it's reasonable for people who pay much more for their ticket [to] receive enhanced benefits". So why not do it the way it's been for 25 or so years; sleeper passengers' get free hot meals in the dining car, while coach has to pay for it. I would consider that a pretty decent benefit, and don't see why the latter group have to get cut out altogether.

 

[cpotisch]

I just noticed that the calorie counts are conspicuously absent from the new menu.

Once/If Amtrak Food Facts gets the new menu, you'll have it there.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

Conventional Amtrak dining cars have always served coach passengers, and they managed without any pre-order system. And let's not forget that before contemporary dining, the LSL had one of the highest rates of diner utilization by coach passengers in the Amtrak system (something like 50%). So not only does cutting coach passengers out of the diner alienate the more budget-constrained customers, but it also means that Amtrak is missing out on quite a bit of diner revenue.

Well 1st... many of those coach passengers are still giving amtrak f&b revenue in the cafe car. (I didn't say all.. but I'm sure many are). 

2nd... in order to get that extra revenue, amtrak has to hire 2 more full time employees, and have a larger supply of food on board. 

So business wise I can see where this makes sense. Now getting it to a point where customers are happy...  looks like they are working on it. (Though this still seems a few steps away from ideal... very little variety).

 

[cpotisch]

Well 1st... many of those coach passengers are still giving amtrak f&b revenue in the cafe car. (I didn't say all.. but I'm sure many are). 

2nd... in order to get that extra revenue, amtrak has to hire 2 more full time employees, and have a larger supply of food on board. 

So business wise I can see where this makes sense. Now getting it to a point where customers are happy...  looks like they are working on it. (Though this still seems a few steps away from ideal... very little variety).

How do you know that they would need two more full time employees? They wouldn't have to completely go back to the old system just to also serve coach passengers.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

Oh I thought you were suggesting it should have stayed like it always was. 

So what are you suggesting? That coach passengers can enter the diner, order one of the few entrees and a drink, and then eat it in the diner? Since there is no table service and no real "Dining experience" left I'm not sure what the appeal is.   

 

[Triley]

The Viewliner II diners used as "Sleeper Lounges" on the LSL are the exact same as those on the Meteor. And I'm pretty sure they do have backup power.

Batteries are for emergency lights only. No power to HVAC, outlets, or any kitchen equipment. Think about how high the power requirement would be for all that.

 

[Steve4031]

The elusive breakfast sandwich photo on the lakeshore limited.  Actually looks good.   

 

[Steve4031]

The elusive breakfast sandwich photo on the lakeshore limited.  Actually looks good.   

I have have now eaten it and I enjoyed it.  Of course I miss the pancakes and sausage.  But this is an improvement.  

The attendant did not speak.  Just pointed.   I asked for the sandwich and coffee.  She sat at her table and played music.  Was super friendly with crew members.  I was not impressed.  

I am somewhat inclined to buy food from the snack car and sit there later today and play some AC/DC on my phone.  If she can play her music I can play mine. 

 

[Thirdrail7]

Conventional Amtrak dining cars have always served coach passengers, and they managed without any pre-order system. And let's not forget that before contemporary dining, the LSL had one of the highest rates of diner utilization by coach passengers in the Amtrak system (something like 50%). So not only does cutting coach passengers out of the diner alienate the more budget-constrained customers, but it also means that Amtrak is missing out on quite a bit of diner revenue.

I agree that "it's reasonable for people who pay much more for their ticket [to] receive enhanced benefits". So why not do it the way it's been for 25 or so years; sleeper passengers' get free hot meals in the dining car, while coach has to pay for it. I would consider that a pretty decent benefit, and don't see why the latter group have to get cut out altogether.

What you're forgetting is the whole premise of this concept: eliminating losses and for 25 years, Amtrak has not eliminated or losses. That is the goal. 2020 is closing in.

How do you know that they would need two more full time employees? They wouldn't have to completely go back to the old system just to also serve coach passengers.

That may be true, but you'll still need more stock, more space and more diversity of product.  This leads to more shrink, more spoilage or more "we're already out of that" as they stock less of each item to keep losses at a minimum.

2020 is closing.

 

[cpotisch]

Oh I thought you were suggesting it should have stayed like it always was. 

So what are you suggesting? That coach passengers can enter the diner, order one of the few entrees and a drink, and then eat it in the diner? Since there is no table service and no real "Dining experience" left I'm not sure what the appeal is.   

I'm saying that I don't think it would be that difficult to slap some price tags on the breakfast buffet and boxed meals and open it up to coach passengers. I don't think that would require them to completely go back to the old system or adding two more employees.

 

[cpotisch]

The Viewliner II diners used as "Sleeper Lounges" on the LSL are the exact same as those on the Meteor. And I'm pretty sure they do have backup power.

Batteries are for emergency lights only. No power to HVAC, outlets, or any kitchen equipment. Think about how high the power requirement would be for all that.

I was responding to 1@cocojacoby[/USER] 's experience where the dining car staff had to put glow sticks out during an engine change. So I don't think the lack of HVAC, outlets, or kitchen equipment would have necessitated that.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

I'm saying that I don't think it would be that difficult to slap some price tags on the breakfast buffet and boxed meals and open it up to coach passengers. I don't think that would require them to completely go back to the old system or adding two more employees.

I haven't ridden these trains since the changes so I can't comment on how that may or may not work based on how the sleeping car passengers are using the car. But since the car is now just a car of tables, there is nothing special about it vs. the cafe / ssl car. So the appeal of eating in the diner really isn't there... it's not an experience anymore than eating in the cafe / SSL car is. So if your argument is that coach passengers should have access to the menu items.. I agree, but I'm guessing many would not sell at the price points that would be set for them.  The breakfast items are already available in the cafe aren't they?  

I'm def. not saying the current set-up is perfect, I just think opening it up to coach passengers takes away one of the few nice things... having a "sleeper" lounge. 

 

[crescent-zephyr]

The elusive breakfast sandwich photo on the lakeshore limited.  Actually looks good.   

I have have now eaten it and I enjoyed it.  Of course I miss the pancakes and sausage.  But this is an improvement.  

The attendant did not speak.  Just pointed.   I asked for the sandwich and coffee.  She sat at her table and played music.  Was super friendly with crew members.  I was not impressed.  

I am somewhat inclined to buy food from the snack car and sit there later today and play some AC/DC on my phone.  If she can play her music I can play mine. 

It's that charming amtrak style of customer service that has made me a more loyal Delta customer than I had ever dreamed of. As much as I prefer train travel, a few trips on Delta First Class (which are no more $$$ than a sleeper) and you miss it less and less.  I still love train travel and I genuinely like the amtrak equipment and don't mind the speeds. But it's that style of attitude that I encountered too many times that made me take less amtrak travel. 

 

[Steve4031]

Well I wandered down to the lounge car to try the the tavern ham sandwich.  Was not impressed.  I provided photos.  I took one for the team.  

The lsa was very friendly and outgoing.  I had forgotten the lsa was in the lounge car so I innocently commented it was nice to meet a smiling face.  She was cleaning tables with paper towels and a spray cleaner as we spoke.  I mentioned that was a first.  She appreciated the compliments.  

She asked about the not so friendly employee.  I told her about the experience in the diner at breakfast and the music.  She was concerned and I said, don’t worry, I’m enjoying my trip.  She stated, I’m the LSA and I expect people to do their jobs.  I’ll go back and talk to her later.  She comped me the tavern sandwich and popcorn.  

I went back later to get my angus burger with cheese for lunch with Doritos. I had my credit card out to pay.  She again comped me.  She stated you paid for this when you bought that ticket.  On my trip in November the lsa in the lounge charged me. So I don’t know if this would happen for everyone.  

I carried the food back to the diner.  There was no music. She was nice to some but not me.  She must have put 2 and 2 together because not many were going to the lounge for food.