Miami Intermodal Center at Miami International Airport

[brianpmcdonnell17]

That is sort of the point I was trying to make. Not that Amtrak is going to move into the new station soon, but that they could if they wanted to and they are the ones preventing the change. Without a doubt, the new station would be operationally more difficult. The benefit would come to the passengers, with direct connections to Metrorail as well as many bus routes, rental cars, and the Airport. The station itself is also in a better area and appears more modern, although it is roughly the same size as the current one if not smaller. Regardless of who is to blame for this project, a politician could use it as an example of government waste on Amtrak with it being a brand new station with 4 tracks and 2 platforms (Tri-Rail usually only uses one track and never more than two, both of which use the same platform). As shown in my pictures, the Amtrak building is also entirely completed and even signed with the Amtrak logo as well as some things in the interior such as the restrooms and the signs pointing to them.

 

[jis]

We can make all the arguments we want here over and over and over again. It will not change a thing though.

And Politicians can make a point over and over and over, as long as they don't bring money to the table, or arrange some other attractive quid pro quo, nothing is going to change.

If everyone who claims Amtrak should be run as a business ( and I have not come across too many politicians who don't) is serious about it, the basic computation here would be "Does extending service cover the cost of doing so from added revenue?". At least Boardman's regime claimed it would not. I doubt that Anderson's will think differently. Unfortunately.

 

[chrsjrcj]

FDOT was in charge of the project and blamed Amtrak, when as far as I understand it, no one asked Amtrak how long the platform should be. The original Miami Airport platform actually extended further south, all the way to NW 21st Street.

Around the same time this was being constructed, there was excitement over Amtrak finally using the FEC between West Palm and Jacksonville. I believe FDOT either applied for a grant, or had made up the application for it. They even ran an inspection train from downtown Miami (not far from the present day Brightline station) to Jacksonville.

Then Rick Scott became governor and likely was behind mothballing that project in addition to the high speed rail. He was going to stop SunRail from starting construction, but our old friend John Mica convinced him otherwise.

 

[chrsjrcj]

The biggest reason for Amtrak to use the MIC would have been the addition of corridor trains along the FEC. The operating proposal I saw included a few Cocoa to Miami Airport trains (think Surfliner). Now, I dont see the benefit of a long distance train connecting to the airport. Maybe the rental car part is good, but many Miami Amtrak visitors are connecting to a cruise the next day.

 

[MARC Rider]

Now, I dont see the benefit of a long distance train connecting to the airport. Maybe the rental car part is good, but many Miami Amtrak visitors are connecting to a cruise the next day.

Yes, and all of the decent hotels to stay at located near the airport. The area around the current Amtrak station is a bit marginal, so if you're arriving and you live out of town, you really need to get to the rental cars, as the Miami area is really the sort of place where you need a car, so access to the car rental is sort of a major requirement. As it currently stands, a taxi from the current Amtrak station to the airport rental car center costs about $20. I'd just rather go up the stairs and get my car. Drop-off is even more of a pain in the neck, as you have to rush from the airport to the station in a taxi during the morning rush hour.

 

[brianpmcdonnell17]

Now, I dont see the benefit of a long distance train connecting to the airport. Maybe the rental car part is good, but many Miami Amtrak visitors are connecting to a cruise the next day.

Yes, and all of the decent hotels to stay at located near the airport. The area around the current Amtrak station is a bit marginal, so if you're arriving and you live out of town, you really need to get to the rental cars, as the Miami area is really the sort of place where you need a car, so access to the car rental is sort of a major requirement. As it currently stands, a taxi from the current Amtrak station to the airport rental car center costs about $20. I'd just rather go up the stairs and get my car. Drop-off is even more of a pain in the neck, as you have to rush from the airport to the station in a taxi during the morning rush hour.

I agree that the Airport station is preferable in this regard, but another option with the current set-up is to take Tri-Rail north to an Amtrak station such as Hollywood.

 

[Palmetto]

Whose idea was it, in the first place, for Amtrak to go to the airport?

 

[neroden]

We can make all the arguments we want here over and over and over again. It will not change a thing though.

And Politicians can make a point over and over and over, as long as they don't bring money to the table, or arrange some other attractive quid pro quo, nothing is going to change.

If everyone who claims Amtrak should be run as a business ( and I have not come across too many politicians who don't) is serious about it, the basic computation here would be "Does extending service cover the cost of doing so from added revenue. At least Boardman's regime claimed it would not. I doubt that Anderson's will think differently. Unfortunately.

The answer is that extending service to an intermodal station covers the cost of doing so from added revenue. If Boardman's and Anderson's idiot staffers think otherwise, they are flatly wrong. There's plenty of evidence for the ridership and revenue increases from this sort of connection, and they're *large*. Increasing Miami revenue by 20%, which is the likely number, is not something to throw away for the operational convenience of lazy Amtrak employees.

 

[neroden]

There are always workarounds available even if there was no platform

From Amtrak's point of view, they move from a facility that is their own and they don't have to pay any rent and is quite adequate. Only the location is a little less than desirable. They are being asked to move to a facility that would cost them extra money and operation will overall be more difficult costing even more money. I suspect they would move there and take the lumps if it was indeed a superior facility. but since it is not, and indeed arguably operationally it is way inferior, they will drag their feet until someone forces them to move by providing monetary incentive, or someone at least funds fixing the station.

It is as simple as that. I remember the right hand man of Boardman telling me exactly this when I met him during the NOL - JAX test run event several years back. Nothing has changed since then, and if anything everyone's position seems to have hardened.

Interesting to realize that Amtrak management is sufficiently incompetent that they don't understand the basic economic principles of train service. I had not realized that Boardman's right hand man was a moron who was unqualified to run anything in a railroad. Is that idiot still there?

 

[neroden]

After looking at the map, the only MIA airport station works for Amtrak is if they move their yard closer. There is no way or place to bring the yard closer unless you buy out some warehouses River Drive. And as JIS stated, unless someone brings alot of money (politicians love "job making programs") the move south is not ( or ain't) happening.

I was like many here was wandering why Amtrak would not want to move into a new facility. After researching it, its plain to see that someone forgot to ask the operations people.

That's because you TELL the operations people, you don't ask them. If you ask them, they'll be idiots and propose revenue-destroying policies, as we are discovering.

Well, perhaps it's all for the best anyway. Brightline is going to destroy Amtrak's Miami business pretty effectively. Arguably Amtrak should bite the bullet and relocate Hialeah shops to a more sensible location, like Pennsylvania. The Silver Service can reverse at Orlando, since nobody will be taking them south of Orlando in a few years.

 

[jis]

Interesting to realize that Amtrak management is sufficiently incompetent that they don't understand the basic economic principles of train service. I had not realized that Boardman's right hand man was a moron who was unqualified to run anything in a railroad. Is that idiot still there?

It was Boardman's decision, not his right hand man's.

The decision was explained to me by his right hand man. I have not been keeping track but I suspect he effectively left with Boardman, or at least reverted out of management position anyway..

 

[Seaboard92]

Brian is still at Amtrak actually. He stepped down from his high position back to an engineer I believe. And he's far happier I believe.

 

[jis]

Brian is still at Amtrak actually. He stepped down from his high position back to an engineer I believe. And he's far happier I believe.

That's what I vaguely recall, since I think I saw a Facebook post about qualifying for GCT or some such. So I figured that indicates back to Engineer, but did not check anything beyond that and did not ask him, though we have talked about other stuff on FB.

 

[AG1]

Why hasn't the title of this thread been corrected during the last 5 years ?. I thought Miami Central Station was in Miami city center and not at the airport.

 

[Palmetto]

Good question. And you're right. It was an error on other boards as well.

 

[cpotisch]

Why hasn't the title of this thread been corrected during the last 5 years ?. I thought Miami Central Station was in Miami city center and not at the airport.

Why hasn't it been corrected? Because there's nothing to correct. Miami Central Station is an alternate name for the airport station.

 

[MARC Rider]

Well, perhaps it's all for the best anyway. Brightline is going to destroy Amtrak's Miami business pretty effectively. Arguably Amtrak should bite the bullet and relocate Hialeah shops to a more sensible location, like Pennsylvania. The Silver Service can reverse at Orlando, since nobody will be taking them south of Orlando in a few years.

I believe Brightline will run to the Orlando Airport, not the Orlando Amtrak station. Travelers from the north will still appreciate a one-seat ride to Miami without having to mess around with a transfer that would include a fairly substantial bus ride.

 

[jis]

Why hasn't the title of this thread been corrected during the last 5 years ?. I thought Miami Central Station was in Miami city center and not at the airport.

Why hasn't it been corrected? Because there's nothing to correct. Miami Central Station is an alternate name for the airport station.

Apparently its official name now is Miami Intermodal Center (MIC) at Miami Airport. Metrorail calls it Miami Airport Station. Tri Rail calls it Miami International Airport. The station boards say Miami Intermodal Center. I can't find anywhere except on the Wikipedia and Curbed page where it is called Miami Central anymore, and those appear to be there from the time when it was indeed referred to as Miami Central, before Brightline happened, and hijacked the name, since that station really is in Central Miami. Wikipedia actually has changed the title of the page to Miami Airport Station, but still redirects Miami Central Station to Miami Airport Station, and has a new page titled MiamiCentral for the Brightline station in actual Central Miami.

So if it does not walk like a Duck, nor quacks like a Duck any more, maybe it has ceased to be a Duck, and should be thusly recognized by AU, instead of pointlessly leaning against windmills.

Good question. And you're right. It was an error on other boards as well.

Once upon a time it was indeed called Miami Central while it was being planned. So the use of that monicker originally at AU was not an error.

 

[pennyk]

I believe Brightline will run to the Orlando Airport, not the Orlando Amtrak station. Travelers from the north will still appreciate a one-seat ride to Miami without having to mess around with a transfer that would include a fairly substantial bus ride.

The "plan" is to run Brightline to the Orlando Airport and eventually possibly run SunRail to the airport. Currently, one can take SunRail from the Orlando Amtrak station to the Sand Lake Road SunRail station, then a bus to the airport. However, currently SunRail runs only on weekdays and there are gaps in coverage during non-peak hours.

 

[brianpmcdonnell17]

After looking at the map, the only MIA airport station works for Amtrak is if they move their yard closer. There is no way or place to bring the yard closer unless you buy out some warehouses River Drive. And as JIS stated, unless someone brings alot of money (politicians love "job making programs") the move south is not ( or ain't) happening.

I was like many here was wandering why Amtrak would not want to move into a new facility. After researching it, its plain to see that someone forgot to ask the operations people.

That's because you TELL the operations people, you don't ask them. If you ask them, they'll be idiots and propose revenue-destroying policies, as we are discovering.

Well, perhaps it's all for the best anyway. Brightline is going to destroy Amtrak's Miami business pretty effectively. Arguably Amtrak should bite the bullet and relocate Hialeah shops to a more sensible location, like Pennsylvania. The Silver Service can reverse at Orlando, since nobody will be taking them south of Orlando in a few years.

Unless/until Brightline extends to Jacksonville and Tampa, there will definitely still be significant Amtrak ridership throughout Florida. Based on my experiences on the Silver Star, few people travel from Orlando to South Florida on that train, with a very large number of passengers traveling north or south out of Tampa. The passengers coming from north of Orlando to South Florida would also likely prefer a one-seat ride to a cross-city transfer in Orlando. However, Orlando to South Florida traffic will be essentially destroyed. In my opinion, the best option is to split both Silver trains in Jacksonville with one segment running on the FEC to Miami (discharge/receive only at the Brightline stops) and the other running the current route of the Silver Star. This would provide much needed additional service to Tampa as well as faster service to South Florida, while maintaining all current stations with at least two frequencies per day. The only loss would be the SM routing south of Orlando, which would be nearly irrelevant with Brightline. The only passengers affected would be those travelling from Sebring or Winter Haven north, who would then have to take the detour via Tampa.

 

[jis]

I believe Brightline will run to the Orlando Airport, not the Orlando Amtrak station. Travelers from the north will still appreciate a one-seat ride to Miami without having to mess around with a transfer that would include a fairly substantial bus ride.

The "plan" is to run Brightline to the Orlando Airport and eventually possibly run SunRail to the airport. Currently, one can take SunRail from the Orlando Amtrak station to the Sand Lake Road SunRail station, then a bus to the airport. However, currently SunRail runs only on weekdays and there are gaps in coverage during non-peak hours.

Isn't there also a somewhat infrequent bus route with a stop within a couple of blocks of the Amtrak Station? I seem to recall finding one when I was looking for viable public transit means to travel from Orlando international Airport to Amtrak Station and decided that there really was none that was convenient for normal mortals (as opposed to public transit freaks

)

 

[brianpmcdonnell17]

Why hasn't the title of this thread been corrected during the last 5 years ?. I thought Miami Central Station was in Miami city center and not at the airport.

Why hasn't it been corrected? Because there's nothing to correct. Miami Central Station is an alternate name for the airport station.

Apparently its official name now is Miami Intermodal Center (MIC) at Miami Airport. Metrorail calls it Miami Airport Station. Tri Rail calls it Miami International Airport. The station boards say Miami Intermodal Center. I can't find anywhere except on the Wikipedia and Curbed page where it is called Miami Central anymore, and those appear to be there from the time when it was indeed referred to as Miami Central, before Brightline happened, and hijacked the name, since that station really is in Central Miami. Wikipedia actually has changed the title of the page to Miami Airport Station, but still redirects Miami Central Station to Miami Airport Station, and has a new page titled MiamiCentral for the Brightline station in actual Central Miami.

So if it does not walk like a Duck, nor quacks like a Duck any more, maybe it has ceased to be a Duck, and should be thusly recognized by AU, instead of pointlessly leaning against windmills.

To add on, the Tri-Rail platforms signage refers to the station as Miami Airport. It's not entirely relavent here, but another interestingly named station is the Tri-Rail/Metrorail transfer station, which is called Tri-Rail by Metrorail and Metrorail Transfer by Tri-Rail, which implies that is the only connecting point, especially with little to no signage about the possibility of connecting at the Airport. This made more sense before the Orange Line opened, allowing the connecting point at Miami Airport. While it is slightly longer, the low frequencies of the trains means that it is sometimes faster to transfer there instead. For example, while I was in the area I went to a Marlins game, which ended around 4:20. I was able to get an Orange Line train and have 5-10 minutes to connect with the 5:17 Tri-Rail, whereas the next Green Line train in 25 minutes would have missed the connection.

 

[chrsjrcj]

Welcome to the absurdity known as Miami Dade Transit.

There was an effort to increase ridership on the Orange line, by running trains every 15 minutes as opposed to every 30 minutes during the weekend. I believe they scraped that, because $.

 

[brianpmcdonnell17]

Welcome to the absurdity known as Miami Dade Transit.

There was an effort to increase ridership on the Orange line, by running trains every 15 minutes as opposed to every 30 minutes during the weekend. I believe they scraped that, because $.

30 minute frequencies for rapid transit are ridiculous enough as it is, but the scheduling is what really struck me as absurd. Whenever a train on either line came, the other line followed within 5 minutes and then there was at least a 25 minute gap. Considering most riders use the segment where both lines run, this really reduces the efficiency of the system. It may be different on weekdays, but if they are really serious about saving money while harming as few passengers as possible they may as well run one of the lines west of Earlington Heights as a shuttle if they are going to be that close together. Having said that, Miami has easily the best transit system in Florida (not that that's saying much): in the Tampa area, there are no trains except a tourist streetcar and the Silver Star, and many of the bus routes operate on weekdays only with less than hourly schedules when they are running.

 

[pennyk]

I believe Brightline will run to the Orlando Airport, not the Orlando Amtrak station. Travelers from the north will still appreciate a one-seat ride to Miami without having to mess around with a transfer that would include a fairly substantial bus ride.

The "plan" is to run Brightline to the Orlando Airport and eventually possibly run SunRail to the airport. Currently, one can take SunRail from the Orlando Amtrak station to the Sand Lake Road SunRail station, then a bus to the airport. However, currently SunRail runs only on weekdays and there are gaps in coverage during non-peak hours.

Isn't there also a somewhat infrequent bus route with a stop within a couple of blocks of the Amtrak Station? I seem to recall finding one when I was looking for viable public transit means to travel from Orlando international Airport to Amtrak Station and decided that there really was none that was convenient for normal mortals (as opposed to public transit freaks

)

Yes, I have taken that bus to the Amtrak station from downtown (either before SunRail was running or when timing did not work), which travels further to the airport. A friend (a 93 year old who rides a scooter) took the bus last week from downtown and he said it was supposed to take about 50 minutes and took closer to 70 minutes (however, I did not double check his information). I think that bus runs once an hour.