New train (40-41 Floridian) between Miami and Chicago via Washington DC

[PatchesC]

A test booking for Wed Nov 27th out of Miami has interesting results on the #40 Floridian.
You can go to Washington DC for $134 or all the way to Chicago for $113.
I thought it would have been more expensive to travel a longer distance.

And looks like Traditional dining the entire way?

 

[Amtrak25]

Train 41 means Chicago to Miami, and vice versa, the opposite of what the Three River was.

Dwell time in DC is 59 minutes to Chicago; 38 minutes to Miami. This is going to be a disaster for both halves of the route.

Imagine the Pennsylvanian refugees in Pittsburgh waiting up for this thing.

 

[JWM]

I applaud the traditional dining if indeed it does begin on the CHI-WAS leg. Like others, I am also worried about the short amount of time in D.C. Finally, will they wash the cars in Chicago and Miami? I am trying to be positive, but I see a recipe for disaster here.

 

[Eric in East County]

This morning (9-22-2024), we received new e-tickets with modifications to our trip scheduled for next May. We originally had tickets for a passage from Chicago to Toledo on Capitol Limited No. 30. Now, we will be on Floridian No. 41 which departs from Chicago and arrives in Toledo at the same times as the CL No. 30 was supposed to. For our return trip, we were originally scheduled to travel from Toledo to Chicago on Capitol Limited No. 29. Now we will be on Floridian No. 40 which departs Toledo and arrives in Chicago at the same times that CL No. 29 was supposed to.

 

[PatchesC]

Train 41 means Chicago to Miami, and vice versa, the opposite of what the Three River was.

Dwell time in DC is 59 minutes to Chicago; 38 minutes to Miami. This is going to be a disaster for both halves of the route.

Imagine the Pennsylvanian refugees in Pittsburgh waiting up for this thing.

The route doesn't really save much time if going CHI-MIA, up until Savannah GA it arrives 81ish minutes before the Silver Star originally did. After that it decreases to a whole 26 minutes early in MIA. I haven't looked into return

 

[Amtrak25]

They are not trying to save time, but to send Superliners out west to cover up for the fact that Beech Grove is slow to put out equipment since they operate only on one shift.

They should have put some more thought into this, done something more comprehensive, and recognize what works on paper won't in reality.

 

[thefirewarde]

I still don't see how a two day East Coast train is any worse off than a two day West Coast train for timeliness. Plus, this creates some interesting new one seat connections that haven't existed in decades - it's a real world test (as well as an operational necessity) that could bring a new LD route into existence if it goes well and Amtrak is able to fund the trainsets for it in the new LD order.

 

[zephyr17]

Amtrak had a train with this name in the 1970's and it was a total dud due to track conditions in Indiana. Can't believe they couldn't come up with something else. Also, I predict this new one won't last long, but who knows.

Track conditions do not follow the name, so no concern there. Unless the name is somehow cursed, I imagine it'll do about as well as the Cap and Star have done. Amtrak is not leaving the CHI-WAS or WAS-TPA-MIA markets, which remain the targets of the train. As many have mentioned, it is a primarily an equipment utilization move, not really a move for the Chicago-Florida market.

Apparently less expensive. I noticed that cost/mile decreases

Probably in different buckets for the for the different city pairs.

And looks like Traditional dining the entire way?
View attachment 37851

Probably will switch to NER and Floridian for the NYP-CHI segment of my November 2025 trip. Would have liked to ride the Cap again but have been avoiding it since COVID since it had no Sightseer and Flex meals. Getting traditional back makes the route much more appealing.

 

[chadamfleetrailfan]

With this happening, I'm assuming that the route will have amfleets or horizons as the NY tunnels will not be able to accommodate the CL's superliners?

 

[Seaboarder3023]

My theory is that this will be a temporary thing until they can sort out the equipment issues, and then possibly getting the actual Floridian running via Atlanta. After that, the Cap and Star will come back. Either way, this is very interesting to see from my perspective, as Amtrak hasn't added a new LD train since I've been alive, even if it really is just combining two existing ones.

 

[Amtrak25]

Probably will switch to NER and Floridian for the NYP-CHI segment of my November 2025 trip. Would have liked to ride the Cap again but have been avoiding it since COVID since it had no Sightseer and Flex meals. Getting traditional back makes the route much more appealing.

Might they rebook sleeper passengers on Acela 1st class or the Lake Shore Ltd altogether ?

 

[zephyr17]

With this happening, I'm assuing that the route will have amfleets or horizons as the NY tunnels will not be able to accommodate the CL's superliners?

The closest 40/41 will come to New York is Washington, DC. That Superliners do not clear the Baltimore tunnels, the North River and East River tubes is immaterial to 40 and 41.

AFAIK, 40/41's entire route could clear Superliners. But one of the main reasons for the change is to free up Superliners, so it'll be an Amfleet II/Viewliner consist.

 

[Amtrak25]

The closest 40/41 will come to New York is Washington, DC. That Superliners do not clear the Baltimore tunnels, the North River and East River tubes is immaterial to 40 and 41.

AFAIK, 40/41's entire route could clear Superliners. But one of the main reasons for the change is to free up Superliners, so it'll be an Amfleet II/Viewliner consist.

If they someday reroute via Philly, like the Washington section of the Bway Ltd once did, or even detour due to a freight derailment on the B&O, the Superliners would not clear one or maybe both of the Baltimore tunnels, and incompatible with any high level platform.

 

[zephyr17]

Train 41 means Chicago to Miami, and vice versa, the opposite of what the Three River was.

Dwell time in DC is 59 minutes to Chicago; 38 minutes to Miami. This is going to be a disaster for both halves of the route.

Imagine the Pennsylvanian refugees in Pittsburgh waiting up for this thing.

It just becomes like a 2 night western LD which cover similar distances and are of similar duration.

Washington pretty much serves the same function as Albuquerque, Denver or Minot. A major, mid-route service stop with similar dwell times to those cities.

Pittsburgh is no worse off than a Kansas City or Salt Lake City with marginal scheduled times to start with that get bad with a late train.

I don't see wailing, weeping and rending of garments for the Builder, CZ or SW Chief. I fail to see how the Floridian is any different.

 

[jis]

With this happening, I'm assuming that the route will have amfleets or horizons as the NY tunnels will not be able to accommodate the CL's superliners?

It will use consists that look like the current Silver Star consist. So yes, single level Amfleet and Viewliner.

My theory is that this will be a temporary thing until they can sort out the equipment issues, and then possibly getting the actual Floridian running via Atlanta. After that, the Cap and Star will come back.

I don't think a Floridian via Atlanta (which BTW Amtrak has never ever run before) will happen in the next twenty years, whereas the Star and Cap returning to their original identities could happen as early as in two years when the East River Tunnel work is completed in New York City area.

 

[zephyr17]

Might they rebook sleeper passengers on Acela 1st class or the Lake Shore Ltd altogether ?

Have no idea, but my guess would be rebooking in NER Business Class. That is what is initially presented when booking NYP-WAS-CHI and choosing a sleeper.

However, there probably are relatively few existing bookings. Sales on the Star to/from stations north of WAS have been blocked for a quite a while, long before this became official today.

 

[Jack Kittle]

checking prices on January 14 shows a CHI-MIA coach seat for $113, a bedroom for $1257 and a roomette for $1376.

 

[PatchesC]

Probably in different buckets for the for the different city pairs.

I'm using full route costs of each. Going by lowest fare buckets for Silver Star full route posted in July, cheapest Roomette comes in at 37 cents/mile
Capitol Limited comes in at 73 cents/mile (the highest of all LD routes).
So far the cheapest roomette I can find for Floridian is $734, at 39 cents/mile.

 

[JWM]

Please take a look at both the Traditional Dining and Flex Dining pages. The current "CL" is gone from both. Starvation until November?

 

[jis]

Please take a look at both the Traditional Dining and Flex Dining pages. The current "CL" is gone from both. Starvation until November?

I have heard that the train will be operated with Miami OBS between Miami and Washington DC, and Chicago OBS between Washington and Chicago. New Chef positions have been created in the Chicago base to handle traditional dining on this train. Maybe those new folks are coming on line before the trains actually become run through. Just wondering idly I suppose.

 

[Eric in East County]

I think most everyone will agree that the potential for events occurring that can delay a long-distance train (freight interference, trespasser incidents, equipment failures, signal issues, track work, derailments, sever weather incidents, etc.) increases in direct proportion to the distance that must be traveled. As we have seen, just traveling the distance from Washington, D.C. to Chicago sometimes resulted in the Capitol Limited running hours late or having to be canceled outright. Add to this the distance between Miami and Washington D.C. and the odds of trains being delayed become even greater. There are probably some safeguards built into the schedule. For example, if a hurricane threatens Miami, No. 40 would probably originate at some point further north that was out of the hurricane’s path. We’ll just have to wait and see how the Floridian performs.

 

[west point]

Fares from the CHI - Pittsburg are really cheap. Connections from the west of CHI so far are only loaded on the Chief and only some days. These coach fares are really cheap. Will Amtrak have enough coach seats especially 1st few days?.

Service is interesting. Since before Amtrak was born riders from South Bend to Cleveland can now get a one seat ride to Florida with sleepers also. South of Cleveland to just before WASH will be first time I could find a single seat coach and sleeper service to Florida ever. Surely Pittsburgh would have had a single car service to Florida by B&O or PRR?

 

[PRR 60]

Floridian Timetable.

 

[PRR 60]

And westbound:

 

[chadamfleetrailfan]

So, will the Capitol Limited and the Silver Star names still exist? Or will they be both be fully overwritten with the Floridian name?