NW Mudslide Season 2015-16
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AC4400
Lead Service Attendant
Will the construction affect Cascades, Empire Builder, and Sounder trains?
It could, although the disruption would probably be limited to slow orders near where the construction is going on.
neroden
Engineer
Endless work. They have been targeting the most frequent slide zones first, but there are a *lot* of slide zones.
Because building tracks at the base of unstable cliffs was a pretty dumb move by the Great Northern. I don't know why BNSF or its predecessors abandoned the Northern Pacific line.
Because building tracks at the base of unstable cliffs was a pretty dumb move by the Great Northern. I don't know why BNSF or its predecessors abandoned the Northern Pacific line.
The former NP line via Stampede Pass was used by Amtrak in its early days, and is still used for freight today. The Stampede Pass tunnels are not tall enough for double-stack freights, but they will (I understand) accommodate Superliners, and could certainly fit Talgos or other single-level equipment. Passenger service via that route, serving Ellensburg and other sizable towns, is still desired, but the state doesn't have the money to start such service at the moment.
neroden
Engineer
I was referring to the *other* Northern Pacific line, the north-south one, better known as the "Eastside Rail Corridor" and "Burke-Gilman Trail" today. It provides an inland route from Everett to Seattle. (and from Everett to south of Seattle). No mudslides.
Except the connection to Seattle King St. Station was completely ripped out and is now a bike trail. Riiight. And then the through-route on the east side was severed and the track ripped out, so it can't even be used for freight. Riiiight.
Basically this was the only alternative route from Seattle to Vancouver BC. One good mudslide or some sea level rise or a tsunami and there's no way to get from Seattle to Vancouver BC by rail, short of going through Idaho and then through Cranbrook and Golden in BC. It seems unwise of BNSF to have put all its eggs in this one mudslide-prone basket.
Except the connection to Seattle King St. Station was completely ripped out and is now a bike trail. Riiight. And then the through-route on the east side was severed and the track ripped out, so it can't even be used for freight. Riiiight.
Basically this was the only alternative route from Seattle to Vancouver BC. One good mudslide or some sea level rise or a tsunami and there's no way to get from Seattle to Vancouver BC by rail, short of going through Idaho and then through Cranbrook and Golden in BC. It seems unwise of BNSF to have put all its eggs in this one mudslide-prone basket.
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Yes, you are 100% right about the short-sightedness.
Mudslide between Tacoma and Olympia, 513 halted at Tacoma. Don't know yet whether there will be buses or not.
They are waiting for buses to Olympia. From there they will put passengers on the equipment from 506 to go further south. We decided to walk to the Tacoma Dome and take ST 594 back to Seattle.
Aloha
Mud density is much higher than snow. I know of an arena that had a roof designed for a 12 foot snow load. It's roof collapsed from 4 inches of Ice.
They set up a bus bridge for the passengers from 513, who are being bussed from Tacoma to Olympia, where they are to be put on the equipment from 506. The 506 passengers are to be bussed and placed on 513's equipment at Tacoma.
http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Storm-damages-tracks-and-causes-railroad-Amtrak-6632469.php
http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Storm-damages-tracks-and-causes-railroad-Amtrak-6632469.php
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Living in a swamp in the snow belt just South of Lake Superior, I'm much too familiar with the densities of mud and snow. But snow sheds aren't designed to hold all the snow that avalanches - they're designed with sloping roofs to divert the avalanching snow over and away from the tracks. Just design the mud shed roofs to divert mud instead of snow.
Yes, the year after I played there with Ice Capades. I forget just how much after I was there that it happened.
Aloha
neroden
Engineer
Query: is this mudslide north of Nisqually Junction or south of Nisqually Junction?
If it's north of Nisqually Junction, Cascades will be out of that area permanently starting in 2017, thanks to the Point Defiance Bypass.
OK, found it, it's north of Nisqually:
http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Storm-damages-tracks-and-causes-railroad-Amtrak-6632469.php
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I haven't been able to find that out, but given the geography, I suspect you're right -- and the affected area will be bypassed soon.
In related news, the fire in the Olympic Peninsula's rainforest is finally out.
Precipitation finally extinguishes Paradise Fire in Olympic National Park
Precipitation finally extinguishes Paradise Fire in Olympic National Park
CHAMILTON
It left Seattle on Tuesday, Thursday, Friday Sunday, leaving at 5 pm and arrived CHI about 7 pm.
It left Chicago at 11:05 am, and arrived SEA at 9:05 am.
In 1981, it ran seven days a week during the summer, otherwise 3 days a week.
The route was discontinued about September 1981. By then the North Coast Limited had been also canceled.
I rode the EB on this route in 1979. They had the Superliners.
It left Seattle on Tuesday, Thursday, Friday Sunday, leaving at 5 pm and arrived CHI about 7 pm.
It left Chicago at 11:05 am, and arrived SEA at 9:05 am.
In 1981, it ran seven days a week during the summer, otherwise 3 days a week.
The route was discontinued about September 1981. By then the North Coast Limited had been also canceled.
NW cannonball
Conductor
Was there a mudslide between Seattle and Everett last 2 days? Seems probable from news reports. Probably why #8 is late this morning in MN.
Looks like a big lot of rain and floods PDX-SEA continuing through week end
Looks like a big lot of rain and floods PDX-SEA continuing through week end
There was a mudslide north of Seattle recently. Also a lot flooding in Portland and Spokane.
D T Nelson
Lead Service Attendant
I'm on the late 8 in question. There was a slide near Mukilteo Monday evening, so we were bused from Seattle to Everett. There were two buses, but the train left Everett immediately after the first bus arrived. The poor people on the second bus had to ride the bus back to Seattle, get put on a new bus, and then ride the bus to Spokane, making stops in Leavenworth and Wenatchee. With no food. The train had left Everett only about a half hour late, but it waited for the bus in Spokane and departed about three hours late.
What a colossal blunder by Amtrak. Fortunately for me, on a last-second change of mind, I got on the first bus in Seattle.
fairviewroad
Engineer
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Mudslides don't just close train tracks. A slide has shut the northbound lanes of I-5 near Woodland, WA. What's especially interesting about this location is that this is the stretch of I-5 where the tracks that carry the Cascades and Coast Starlight run on the median of the interstate. You can clearly see the tracks from the aerial shots in this TV report.
It does not appear that the slide touched the tracks, and it does not appear that the tracks are closed (based on the fact that the Cascades trains still seem to be moving through the area). As you can imagine, it's very difficult to drive from PDX to SEA right now (there's a detour along the Oregon side of the Columbia River up to Longview, but it's a two-lane road and reportedly very congested). In this case, people on BoltBus are probably wishing they bought a train ticket!
It's not known how long the closure will last. WSDOT is reportedly going to try to set up 2-way traffic in the southbound lanes, which of course will have the effect of slowing traffic in both directions, but is probably better than the lengthy detour.
It does not appear that the slide touched the tracks, and it does not appear that the tracks are closed (based on the fact that the Cascades trains still seem to be moving through the area). As you can imagine, it's very difficult to drive from PDX to SEA right now (there's a detour along the Oregon side of the Columbia River up to Longview, but it's a two-lane road and reportedly very congested). In this case, people on BoltBus are probably wishing they bought a train ticket!
It's not known how long the closure will last. WSDOT is reportedly going to try to set up 2-way traffic in the southbound lanes, which of course will have the effect of slowing traffic in both directions, but is probably better than the lengthy detour.
fairviewroad
Engineer
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Sounds like a lane of NB I-5 could open as soon as this evening. In the meantime, officials on the Oregon side are discouraging use of Hwy 30 as a detour due to heavy congestion.
And....some officials are actually putting two-and-two together and are recommending that people, you know, take the train. They'll have four more departures to choose from the rest of today.
And....some officials are actually putting two-and-two together and are recommending that people, you know, take the train. They'll have four more departures to choose from the rest of today.
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