Pacific Parlour Car Permanently Retired February 2018

[zephyr17]

I am still waiting for the giant ants to emerge again.

 

[Bob Dylan]

I am still waiting for the giant ants to emerge again.

FOTFLMAO!

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

I am still waiting for the giant ants to emerge again.

FOTFLMAO!

Make me a sergeant in charge of the booze...make me a sergeant and give me the booze!

 

[cocojacoby]

Just discussing the ADA requirements on another site and concluded that the PPC was not in compliance. Wonder if that weighed into the decision at all?

 

[DevalDragon]

Doesn't have to be because of the car's age. Unless they do any further modifications of course.

 

[cpotisch]

Just discussing the ADA requirements on another site and concluded that the PPC was not in compliance. Wonder if that weighed into the decision at all?

I wonder if that was because of the "step" between the PPC and Superliners.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Doesn't have to be because of the car's age. Unless they do any further modifications of course.

If I recall correctly the PPC fleet was refurbished multiple times after passage of the ADA. Presumably it was grandfathered in and didn't need substantial ADA rework unless structurally modified.

 

[Seaboard92]

Our cars are exempt from ADA and we have gutted rebuilt the interiors as recent as 2016 and 2017. One was built in 1947 and one was in 1948. As long as the actual shell was built prior to the ADA cutoff I'm not sure about what the legislation says but it should be exempt.

Now that I think about it buying all five of the PPCs could make a good dinner train. #badideas

 

[akbrian]

How is anything on the upper level of any of the cars ADA compliant? You'd have to climb the stairs to get there.

 

[zepherdude]

How is anything on the upper level of any of the cars ADA compliant? You'd have to climb the stairs to get there.

There is a lower level for handicap passengers.

 

[cpotisch]

How is anything on the upper level of any of the cars ADA compliant? You'd have to climb the stairs to get there.

As I understand it, for the most part, so long as disabled passengers have access to the same services and amenities as able-bodied passengers, it's allowed. Since disabled pax can get rooms or seats on the lower level, can get their meals brought to their rooms, etc, it's allowed.

 

[trainman74]

How is anything on the upper level of any of the cars ADA compliant? You'd have to climb the stairs to get there.

Being unable to climb stairs is not the only type of disability that's covered by the ADA.

 

[seat38a]

How is anything on the upper level of any of the cars ADA compliant? You'd have to climb the stairs to get there.

Believe it or not, the government has the answer to your question!

https://www.access-board.gov/guidelines-and-standards/transportation/vehicles/technical-assistance-manuals-on-adaag-for-transportation-vehicles/subpart-e-commuter-rail-cars-and-systems

https://www.access-board.gov/guidelines-and-standards/transportation/vehicles/technical-assistance-manuals-on-adaag-for-transportation-vehicles/subpart-d-light-rail-vehicles-and-systems

 

[jis]

Now that I think about it buying all five of the PPCs could make a good dinner train. #badideas

Or first reduce oneself to a Hundredaire from a Millionnaire as the necessary mechanical repairs and upgrades are completed using hand crafted replacement parts - or something like that. And then one has to figure out the food stuff and the rest of it.

 

[cpotisch]

Now that I think about it buying all five of the PPCs could make a good dinner train. #badideas

Or first reduce oneself to a Hundredaire from a Millionnaire as the necessary mechanical repairs and upgrades are completed using hand crafted replacement parts - or something like that. And then one has to figure out the food stuff and the rest of it.

There a bunch of Hi-Levels at Ozark Mountain Railcar. He could buy one or two of those for parts. And there are a lot of rail fans who would love to take a ride in the PPCs once again. Not saying that he should do this, but it is theoretically feasible.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Now that I think about it buying all five of the PPCs could make a good dinner train. #badideas

Or first reduce oneself to a Hundredaire from a Millionnaire as the necessary mechanical repairs and upgrades are completed using hand crafted replacement parts - or something like that. And then one has to figure out the food stuff and the rest of it.

Does the cost and severity of maintenance change if you remove them from active interchange duty and keep them isolated on private tracks? Just wondering how relatively tiny tourist railroads keep their rolling stock funcational without running into Amtrak level maintenance problems.

 

[jis]

I think a lot of volunteer labor and the relatively few pieces that have to be maintained to run at generally much slower speed with much lower accepted reliability makes a huge difference. Running stuff on an isolated tourist line is a very different thing from running cars attached to Amtrak trains on main line at track speed.

But Seaboard I am sure can give a much more knowledgeable answer.

 

[Seaboard92]

I've never actually worked on an isolated network so I actually don't have an answer at least from experience. But I do have some anecdotal experience from friends in the industry.

The only completely off network one I've been exposed to by a friend is Stone Mountain Scenic and they purposely took their interchange out so they wouldn't be under the same regulations as every other railroad by no longer being under the FRA. Now I'm not sure how true that really is.

But one key fact to remember the slower you run the less wear and tear from operations you'll have. Now as far as HVAC that's a different story. So electrical stuff will still face the same load as before. I'll have to ask a few friends who are Carmen for an isolated road and see what they get back to me with.

For the record I wouldn't actually buy the PPCs I hate one of a kind equipment and try to avoid it when purchasing. Unless it's a Cascade Club from the Southern Pacific (Three unit diner, club, lounge) that's a one of a kind car that majorly interests me.

 

[RPC]

Now that I think about it buying all five of the PPCs could make a good dinner train. #badideas

Or first reduce oneself to a Hundredaire from a Millionnaire as the necessary mechanical repairs and upgrades are completed using hand crafted replacement parts - or something like that. And then one has to figure out the food stuff and the rest of it.

Does the cost and severity of maintenance change if you remove them from active interchange duty and keep them isolated on private tracks? Just wondering how relatively tiny tourist railroads keep their rolling stock funcational without running into Amtrak level maintenance problems.

My son volunteers with the Black River & Western in NJ. Their idea of "head end power" is 120VAC single phase running the lights in each car from a portable generator up front with twist-lock connectors between cars. Of course we're talking heavyweight cars with windows that open. What with sealed windows, three-phase HVAC, and on-board cooking equipment, the PPCs are a whole different kettle of fish!

 

[Railspike]

Just saw a Pacific Parlour car on the end of a westbound UP freight at Benson, AZ today. What's up with that?

 

[TinCan782]

Just saw a Pacific Parlour car on the end of a westbound UP freight at Benson, AZ today. What's up with that?

As they were all sold a while back, perhaps the car is just being moved (deadhead) to a new location (owner?). Unoccupied passenger cars may be moved as part of a freight train.
If you had the number it could likely be traced.

 

[AmtrakFlyer]

Sad

 

[Maglev]

One of the elements of modern design is ease of maintenance. The Pacific Parlour Cars were not easy to maintain. A truck overhaul could take weeks for a PPP, but only days for a Superliner.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

One of the elements of modern design is ease of maintenance. The Pacific Parlour Cars were not easy to maintain. A truck overhaul could take weeks for a PPP, but only days for a Superliner.

How often were the trucks of a PPP overhauled?

 

[Maglev]

How often were the trucks of a PPP overhauled?

I don't remember that information from the article in Classic Trains about the Hi-Level cars.