Rumors are flying

[Foodman53]

Indeed, cutting the Palmetto back to NYP-SAV-NYP would place it back on its original schedule when the train was inaugurated in 1976(maybe early 1977). Also, it would cut back the number of trainsets needed back to 2.

North and Southbound had the same schedule....Lv 7:00am....Ar 11:30pm.

(Since this train originally was crewed from NYP, I'm not sure what the crew "layover" or "turnaround" was...since I was part of the JAX crew base during my OBS days during that time period).

However, the "Palmetto" was the first Amtrak long-distance train to be completely "Amfleet equipped"......consist was usually 1 loco, 6 coaches, and 1 "Amdinette-lounge"....no diner, and no checked baggage!!

Since the main feature of this train was "Carolina by daylight".....station stops in Wilson, NC.....Dillon, SC.....Kingstree, SC....and Quantico, VA were re-instituted. The stop in Selma-Smithfield, NC came many years later. Also, this was the only ("almost") Florida service train to have station stops at BWI, Metropark, NJ and North Philly....

Although I only worked for Amtrak until 1980..I really can't recall the "Palmetto" having any real perfomance issues back then...

Just thought you'd want to know!!

From the "Florida Funnel'

Foodman53

 

[Amtrak OBS Employee]

Foodman, are you still employed in the railroad field?

I do believe you are exactly right with this past scenario. From what I can remeber (as this was prior to my employment) in my traveling days, the lounge was stocked with enough supplies to make the round trip from NYP-SAV and back. One of my coworkers informed me that he used to be on that job as the LSA. He said they turned right around and returned the next morning being the schedule was departure out of SAV at 0700. He said the nice part was the four days off at the end of the trip. Now "that" would be livable in my opinion. He didn't say how good the paid hours of the trip were, though I am sure they were pretty good! I also can't recall any real OTP issues with that train either.

 

[battalion51]

I think they would probably make it a two on-three off job now, instead of two and four, but anything is possible. It might go to an Amfleet I consist, but who knows. We shall see what transpires.

 

[railman]

First off.....are you management? If not then, who are you to tell an employee who gives his all when he is on duty? Who ever said I was complaining, buster? I merely made a statement which I believe to be fact! And what you may not realize (if this is really any of your damned business) is when the new contract was signed and ratified, the raise was implemented to OFFSET other costs which we agreement covered employees were gonna have to take on.  I.e the cost of our healthcare, etc. I was not and still am not opposed to paying some towards my health insurance being the cost of healthcare is rising as it is. So in all actuality, we did not get much of a raise, but it was a little something!!! I don't expect Amtrak to pay my whole way, and never will! The company and the union did a good job in my opinion with the new contract as far as how it affects me (which your kind may view as selfish)! And no one is gonna tell me the management doesn't make AT LEAST twice my salary for doing less of my work. I WORK ON THE FRONT LINES, PAL!!!! Management only has to deal with what I deal with when they have to. They have their own crap to deal with, and sometimes have to step up to the plate beside us. But I deal with the cranky passenger for their whole trip, I deal with the usual problems when it comes to working with the public. The manager does not! And farthermore, in my old job prior to my career in the railroad, I WAS A MANAGER! And the money I made (which could and would be considered by anyone a "FAT SALARY") wasn't worth that crap! :angry:

As it so happens, I AM a management employee. And it not just YOUR cost-of-living that goes up, PAL - everyone's does. My health care expense went up consistently over the past three years! You think I got a salary adjustment for that? HELL NO! Contrary to what you or anyone else may think, I do NOT make twice as much as any union employee. In fact, with very little effort and a wee bit of overtime, a TICKET CLERK could overshoot my salary by quite a margin. Don't even BEGIN to venture into the B&B, T&S, T&E, OBS crafts when it comes to comparing salaries - I don't get paid overtime and I don't make tips! Yet my week usually lasts about 50-55 hours for which I draw a 40-hour salary.

It's not just the front-line employees who work hard. I bust my ASS everyday to do my best with very little support from the execs and no budget with which to do it. You think you're the only one with a chip on the shoulder? I never said you were "complaining" - I merely tried to point out your misconceptions about "management".

Next time you want to bash your employer remember - there are lots of people looking and YOU don't know who they might be. I happen to remain dedicated to Amtrak and, after 20 years, highly hopeful that Mr. Gunn will take us into the light at the end of a long dismal tunnel.

 

[GG-1]

Next time you want to bash your employer remember - there are lots of people looking and YOU don't know who they might be. I happen to remain dedicated to Amtrak and, after 20 years, highly hopeful that Mr. Gunn will take us into the light at the end of a long dismal tunnel.

Aloha

Most of hat I have read in this series is anoying but the closing quoted says the most important part and solution to the problem. (shouting intended) WE MUST STICK TOGETHER. No one person does it all, It takes team work, wich includes the riding public.

Yes I am a member of a union.

 

[Anthony]

 

[Amtrak OBS Employee]

First off.....are you management? If not then, who are you to tell an employee who gives his all when he is on duty? Who ever said I was complaining, buster? I merely made a statement which I believe to be fact! And what you may not realize (if this is really any of your damned business) is when the new contract was signed and ratified, the raise was implemented to OFFSET other costs which we agreement covered employees were gonna have to take on.  I.e the cost of our healthcare, etc. I was not and still am not opposed to paying some towards my health insurance being the cost of healthcare is rising as it is. So in all actuality, we did not get much of a raise, but it was a little something!!! I don't expect Amtrak to pay my whole way, and never will! The company and the union did a good job in my opinion with the new contract as far as how it affects me (which your kind may view as selfish)! And no one is gonna tell me the management doesn't make AT LEAST twice my salary for doing less of my work. I WORK ON THE FRONT LINES, PAL!!!! Management only has to deal with what I deal with when they have to. They have their own crap to deal with, and sometimes have to step up to the plate beside us. But I deal with the cranky passenger for their whole trip, I deal with the usual problems when it comes to working with the public. The manager does not! And farthermore, in my old job prior to my career in the railroad, I WAS A MANAGER! And the money I made (which could and would be considered by anyone a "FAT SALARY") wasn't worth that crap! :angry:

As it so happens, I AM a management employee. And it not just YOUR cost-of-living that goes up, PAL - everyone's does. My health care expense went up consistently over the past three years! You think I got a salary adjustment for that? HELL NO! Contrary to what you or anyone else may think, I do NOT make twice as much as any union employee. In fact, with very little effort and a wee bit of overtime, a TICKET CLERK could overshoot my salary by quite a margin. Don't even BEGIN to venture into the B&B, T&S, T&E, OBS crafts when it comes to comparing salaries - I don't get paid overtime and I don't make tips! Yet my week usually lasts about 50-55 hours for which I draw a 40-hour salary.

It's not just the front-line employees who work hard. I bust my ASS everyday to do my best with very little support from the execs and no budget with which to do it. You think you're the only one with a chip on the shoulder? I never said you were "complaining" - I merely tried to point out your misconceptions about "management".

Next time you want to bash your employer remember - there are lots of people looking and YOU don't know who they might be. I happen to remain dedicated to Amtrak and, after 20 years, highly hopeful that Mr. Gunn will take us into the light at the end of a long dismal tunnel.

Well this is the last I am gonna post in regard to this subject. First off.....get over it! I merely made an statement in which it seems to me about a lot of management at Amtrak (company wide) in general! If my supervisor ever asks me how I feel, I will SURELY let him know! I should be able to trust my supervisor with any subject matter regarding work. I am in NO WAY BASHING my employer! If I was, I sure as hell wouldn't be working for Amtrak on my own choice. Where in the hell you come up with that assumption is beyond me!!!! But this is an example of exactly how I see the way things are at Amtrak! There doesn't seem to be much unity between managment and agreement covered employees, hence the need of union representation (and sometimes I wonder about the need of the union but that's a different subject).

Now in regard to your situation (being you are in management), I have reason to believe you are in lower or middle managment! And yes sir, I was in that very same situation in my old career. You're getting crapped on, sir! And that is the bottom line. I truely understand that! However, you have taken THAT responsibility (I am sure you are definitely aware of this)! I have NOT taken that responsibilty. I just may if I were asked to, however, I would really have to think on that one before making a decision.

Now one thing to get off my chest. I DO NOT appreciate being told I am bashing my employer and I have a chip on my shoulder because of making a few statements which I personally believe is so!!! I have never in all my life been told that! I very well may be wrong with that fact, but I am entitled to my opinion. I get the feeling managment doesn't want to hear my opinion! So with that on the record, my reply to bashing my employer is like "biting the hand" which feeds me and my family! And I may very well have a chip on my shoulder, but it appears to me that you just may certainly have one, too!

Once again, sir, this is just my opinion! I have read your opinion and respect your opinion. I am not going to reply any farther on this particular subject matter, however, I completely agree with your closing remark! We need to stick together! But I feel the need to add the following. There needs to be more "unity" between managment (all managment) and the employees (all employees)! Otherwise this all may be all a lost cause. I am willing to make that commitment. I have heard various rumors of Gunn's resignation. I hope he is not even considering that (as matter of fact I hope it is just rumor)! We need him to lead us through these times. At least he has the necessary knowledge of "railroads!" I am willing to make the commitment! I just want managment to SHOW me (not just tell me) they will, too!!! So far from what I can see, Gunn is, but what about the rest of managment? Maybe you will be the one who will show me that! Thanks in advance...... Be well...........

 

[Amtrak OBS Employee]

railman, I am gonna have to offer you an apology in regard to "the chip on the shoulder" part in my last post. I missed the part you included the word "only!" Seems to me you are informing me of your good intentions, and higher managment doesn't wanna hear it either. And you must at times appear to them as I have to you! Be well..........And I would like an oportunity to get to know you if I don't already! I will look out for you in the time being and until then see you here in the forums! Have a good day!

 

[RidesOften]

Yes!!!

I think the bashings got to stop. MOSt Definitely!!!Everyone is intitled to a opinion on this board but opinions are a dime a dozen. The Fact remains We all do our best with what we have. OBS T&E Management and Mr. Gunn who I know is from a very good background homewise and workwise.. I trust him!

He can pull the light at the end of the tunnel if we all stop growling at each other. Give him the chance.!!!! Someone got to look at where all the money goes,

Have you all priced a ticket lately I did yesterday Fla to St. Louis 3 people coach...round trip .... it only 1800 miles

.. I almost fell out of my computer chair!!!! 1000 plus.

Tell me where that money goes!!

I have worked 3 services in 4 years. Amtrak emplyees stick together, and sorry gang that the way it should be.

Now that I said my opinion I will go back to doing what I do natural riding the rails.

If we ALL do our jobs Then we don't need to look over our back, Railman!!!!.

Florida TRains are FUN!!!!!! h34r: h34r:

 

[railman]

Yes!!!I think the bashings got to stop. MOSt Definitely!!!Everyone is intitled to a opinion on this board but opinions are a dime a dozen. The Fact remains We all do our best with what we have. OBS T&E Management and Mr. Gunn who I know is from a very good background homewise and workwise..  I trust him!

He can pull the light at the end of the tunnel if we all stop growling at each other. Give him the chance.!!!!  Someone got to look at where all the money goes,

Have you all priced a ticket lately I did yesterday   Fla to St. Louis 3 people coach...round trip .... it only 1800 miles

.. I almost fell out of my computer chair!!!! 1000 plus.

Tell me where that money goes!!  

  I have worked 3 services in 4 years. Amtrak emplyees stick together, and sorry gang that the way it should be.

Now that I said my opinion I will go back to doing what I do natural riding the rails.

If we  ALL do our jobs Then we don't need to look over our back, Railman!!!!.

Florida TRains are FUN!!!!!!   h34r:     h34r:  

Well, I'm certainly willing to make this MY last post on the topic as well. Yes, I am in middle management. And yes, at times I do feel like the execs are "crapping" on me. Nonetheless, I am also STILL a union member and spent the first 10 years of my Amtrak career in the trenches just like you, so I can speak on the nature and challenges of that work intelligently.

I was asked to move into the management ranks precisely because of my hard work, positive attitude and the good reputation I attained while doing my union job. Do I regret the choice? Sometimes. But I feel that perhaps I may be in a slightly more advantageous position to effect some small but positive changes at the railroad. Mr. Gunn knows me by name and by sight. He has occasionally chatted me up and asked "off the record" for my opinion on this or that, even though I am not a member of his immediate staff.

I strongly encourage any Amtrak employee to speak up and let your voice be heard, but deliver the message you have with a positive tone and a constructive stance. I ride our trains ever day to get to and from work and I have seen some pretty sorry attitudes 'out there'. While I have no jurisdiction or responsibility to address such matters, I try to chat up the employee in question to find out what the beef is, and then see if there is something I can do to get the matter resolved. If I have to, I report the situation (but not the employee).

Anyway, Amtrak OBS Employee (and others) I hope that I have illustrated to you that there are some managmeent-types around who do give a damn about Amtrak and all of its employees. And doing it for not a whole helluva lot of moolah either.

 

[battalion51]

By the way, I heard today second hand from an Upper Management Employee that this is pretty much a done deal. Make plans to see the S-Line if you want to see it.

 

[Mikado]

Ok, dumb question. Wouldn't completely ending train service on the "S" line require a 180-day discontinuance notice? Running the Silver Star into Tampa only preserves service to two cities on the line. My understanding, and I could well be wrong, is that Amtrak could (in theory) terminate the Palmetto everywhere except Jacksonville-Tampa (and Lakeland) since every other point would still have train service (Star/Meteor).

That doesn't at all mean this (plan "B") isn't going to happen, but unless I'm missing something, that it can't happen in October.

 

[AmtrakWPK]

Well, NARP or somebody (so I've been told) apparently reported they are looking at making the NOL-ORL portion of Sunset Limited a daily. If, instead of running it down the A line from Jax (like they do now), run it down the S-Line from Jax (like Palmetto is now), through Tampa and Lakeland, then over and up A-line through Orlando then up to SFA for overnight servicing, and you have done three things: You continued S-Line daily train service, you have provided a daily ORL-Tampa train service, and you now have daily service Chicago-NOL-through to CHS/SAV/JAX/ORL/TPA/MIA. And you don't have to meet the 180 day termination-of-service requirement for S-Line.

 

[battalion51]

One of the ways they can side step the 180-discontinuation notice is if they put in bus service to those cities. Then after a while once there is no one on the buses they can just drop them since you don't have to give 180 day notice on that.

 

[Trogdor]

One of the ways they can side step the 180-discontinuation notice is if they put in bus service to those cities. Then after a while once there is no one on the buses they can just drop them since you don't have to give 180 day notice on that.

Are you sure that's the case? In the example of the two recent 180-day train offs, with the Lake Country Limited and Kentucky Cardinal, both routes also had thruway bus service available, yet they still had to operate the train for 180 days after the announcement.

 

[battalion51]

Someone in Management explained to me (last year when they tried to kill it then) that it could be done with the Thruway Service being there.

 

[Amfleet]

I think the 180 day notice for the K-Card was the fact that it carried express cars, same with the Lake Country Limited that ran out to Janesville, Wisconson. Thruway bus service can only handle passengers, not freight, and the shipping companies probably needed the notice in order to switch their methods of transporting prodcuts.

Except between PHL and JAX, the Palmetto doesn't carry any express so the S-Line service from JAX to TPA could be replaced with a thruway bus for passengers. Also, since roadrailers are not around after October 1 none of the Silver Service trains will probably handle express or mail between the Northeast and Florida.

 

[AlanB]

I think the 180 day notice for the K-Card was the fact that it carried express cars, same with the Lake Country Limited that ran out to Janesville, Wisconson. Thruway bus service can only handle passengers, not freight, and the shipping companies probably needed the notice in order to switch their methods of transporting prodcuts.
Except between PHL and JAX, the Palmetto doesn't carry any express so the S-Line service from JAX to TPA could be replaced with a thruway bus for passengers. Also, since roadrailers are not around after October 1 none of the Silver Service trains will probably handle express or mail between the Northeast and Florida.

No, the 180 rule is for passenger service. It has nothing to do with freight. Amtrak had to issue 180 day warnings for many of the train discontinued years ago, long before they started Express Trak.

 

[Miami Joe]

Heard the rumor today and people talking about possible lay-offs.

Management hasn't said anything.

I hate to lose a train in the yard, but I don't think there would be any furloughs. I think the extra people would be utilized on the PM line and on the other 2 trains. This would improve reliabilty on the running trains tremendously.

I wouldn't be surprised if the cars would still be assigned to Hialeah, so we would still have to PM the cars. So some of the work would be retained.

MJ B)