Silver Star Diner

[Winecliff Station]

And those lowest rates you mentioned are simply the lowest you found - not the lowest bucket rates for each (which are equal after 30 April 2020). It's not unusual to find the lowest bucket or two not being offered at all on the day of an AmSnag search.

I did base it on an AmSnag search, but using the newest available days 11 months out and going 30 days back. The repeatedly lowest fares were 1067 for the SM and 1337 for the SS. Not quite 300.... my bad. While I am not up at midnight to check when first released, I am an early riser and happened to have checked as early as 5am.

That being said, I suppose one could argue that the SS runs six hours longer and therefore has to serve an extra meal, thereby justifying the higher price.

And with that I think I am done obsessing over this analysis for now LOL.... I must really need to get a life eh?

 

[drfonta]

Actually, way past it. The difference between SS and SM bedrooms lowest rates, at least from Ft Lauderdale to NY, is about $300... with the Star being more.

Since you're crunching numbers, this is what I have recorded of for my trip in March 2020, which was NYP to Deland FL (DLD). I had booked and changed tickets several times and am pretty sure I was the first on each occasion to book a bedroom on each train for the same date. The price for the Silver Meteor bedroom with 1 adult Military veteran was $774.10, for the Silver Star it was $614.70. I'm fairly certain these were the lowest prices for each train at the time as they had both gone up as soon as I booked (yes I checked right away to see and I was assigned to bedroom B on the first "10" sleeper car on each trip. As I cancelled/changed my ticket the prices went back down to what I had gotten originally if that makes sense). At that point, the Meteor was 160$ more, travel time a bit less (about 1:30) but only 2 meals (I think) with an 11:38 a.m. scheduled arrival time. Not sure if that helps you or not. Flex dining had been announced for the Meteor when I was doing my booking. Not sure how they figure their pricing and now it's all over the place but these are the numbers that I saw when planning my travel as of Oct 28 2019. As rooms have filled up, prices have changed drastically I see...

 

[MrNews]

9 years ago that would have described almost all Amtrak diners.

Our first LD ride (TPA-WAS) was about 9 years ago- the dining was great. White linen, silverware, flowers, nice steak, and friendly service. I couldn't decide which dessert to have, so our server said "Have two," and brought them. Sadly, on our most recent ride (Sept. '19) we brought our own snacks & a cute, collapsible water boiler. I'm glad we got to experience some of the early-20th-century charm before it was eliminated. The dining was a big part of what made the longer-and-costlier-than-flying journey worth doing.

 

[Palmland]

The ‘Trains’ Newswire reported this today:

“Starting May 1, each Silver Star will get a Viewliner II and its passengers will receive similar treatment. A Trains News Wire analysis of pricing before and after that date confirms that sleeper fares between the same destinations are always higher for the Meteor until May 1 but have identical fare levels following that date, even if varying demand dictates different fares for each train on any given day.”

Still unanswered is the question if the Viewliner diner will be a modified one to also serve as a cafe for coach passengers (and sleeper passengers who’d rather pay than have flex diner food).

 

[Qapla]

Some interesting comments were made in this article - while not specifically mentioning the new Star dining that is about to be implemented ... it certainly makes a point as to why these changes are being made so poorly

https://www.businesstraveller.com/b...half-a-century-amtrak-may-finally-make-money/

Republican Peter DeFazio (D-Ore.), the House Transportation Committee chairman, said that becoming a for-profit company might not be the right goal for Amtrak.
“I think they should think about efficiency but not profit,” he said. “Amtrak is a service, and it can be a better service.”

In the comments section someone made this observation

Only people who don’t understand the public transportation, especially the railroads, can still demand Amtrak to be profitable. There is no passenger railroad in the world that makes profit. It is simply impossible because the capital improvements (right-of-way, rolling stock, etc) the railroads have to do just to keep up. Where is an outcry for highways? The same logic must be used for railroads.

 

[jis]

Republican Peter DeFazio (D-Ore.), the House Transportation Committee chairman, said that becoming a for-profit company might not be the right goal for Amtrak.

I did a double take when I read that....

"Republican Peter DeFazio (D-Ore.)"? Really. I guess proof reading is a lost art.

 

[Mystic River Dragon]

I guess proof reading is a lost art.

So is fact checking. Or even being able to tell fact from fiction. Which is the reason (in my opinion) that Anderson is getting away with a lot of double-speak like flexible dining being an enhanced passenger experience. (I'm surprised he hasn't yet called it crafted and curated as well.)

 

[JRR]

$30 a meal is a bargain when compared to some day when Roomettes are both at next-to-highest bucket on the Silvers. The $273 fare difference for the whole route makes for almost $70 per meal. But on some other day when the SS is at low bucket and the SM is at high bucket that $428 fare difference comes out to about <gulp!> $100 per meal.

But some here would say that's comparing apples to sour grapes.

But it all evens out for travel dates on or after 1 May 2020 when the SS sleeper fares go up to the level of the SM.

The big ? Is, how much of the fare is credited to F&B revenue???

 

[user 1215]

I did a double take when I read that....

"Republican Peter DeFazio (D-Ore.)"? Really. I guess proof reading is a lost art.

Not dismissing the proof reading necessity, not it was supposed to say Rep. or Representative. Journalists using autocorrect now?

 

[riderails]

Just exposed to new dining round trip from Chicago (Cap Limited) to Ft. Lauderdale (Silver Star & S Meteor). Was skeptical after several years of long-distance Amtrak travel. I found the arrangement most relaxing and enjoyable. I find no problem with prearranged meal times, forced ("community") seating, sometimes grumpy wait staff, being evicted from the dining car in the middle of fascinating conversations, and the replication of menus across time and geography. However, having directly experienced the, to many, much maligned dining arrangement, I would not be disappointed if it were activated across the board. I suggest the main feature in need of adjustment is, not surprisingly, the menus. Not the quality but the variety and breadth. I'll add that the sleeping car-restricted "lounge" is a welcome feature that follows from the new dining arrangement.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

Not the quality but the variety and breadth.

What did you have? I thought that the quality was very poor. I agree with you that I can get used to the service and the sleeper lounge idea is nice.

(I had the shrimp and the beef entrees. I wouldn’t order the beef again, the polenta had no flavor and the beef was extremely salty.)

 

[riderails]

Tried all four. Agree on the beef but others were ok.

 

[Winecliff Station]

So is fact checking. Or even being able to tell fact from fiction. Which is the reason (in my opinion) that Anderson is getting away with a lot of double-speak like flexible dining being an enhanced passenger experience. (I'm surprised he hasn't yet called it crafted and curated as well.)

Or international cuisine

 

[me_little_me]

Or international cuisine

Nah! Garbage Fusion!

 

[Lissa]

Not sure of your route but when I calculated the difference in price for my route, divided by the number of meals it came to $30 each. Per person, per meal. Even with the free wine that is highway robbery.

That's pretty much exactly how it worked out with our numbers as well. And since we're vegetarian, it's a far worse deal, since those foods cost less to begin with. Plus, they won't even guarantee that the plant-based items (Things like veggie-burgers) will be available for the duration of the trip. On the Acela line you can put in your request for those items ahead of time, but on the Star we'll just cross our fingers that they start with a decent supply and there isn't a huge demand.

 

[nferr]

Just exposed to new dining round trip from Chicago (Cap Limited) to Ft. Lauderdale (Silver Star & S Meteor). Was skeptical after several years of long-distance Amtrak travel. I found the arrangement most relaxing and enjoyable. I find no problem with prearranged meal times, forced ("community") seating, sometimes grumpy wait staff, being evicted from the dining car in the middle of fascinating conversations, and the replication of menus across time and geography. However, having directly experienced the, to many, much maligned dining arrangement, I would not be disappointed if it were activated across the board. I suggest the main feature in need of adjustment is, not surprisingly, the menus. Not the quality but the variety and breadth. I'll add that the sleeping car-restricted "lounge" is a welcome feature that follows from the new dining arrangement.

You're not allowed to post that lol. You're gonna have the food critics jumping down your
throat. I've never been a big fan of the community seating either and I like the idea of a sleepers lounge. I would like to see more variety in the choices offered. It's fine for the CL/LSL where it's basically one meal and a breakfast but the Crescent and Silver trains have a longer run. But it's not that big a deal to me. The hysteria over it is kind of funny.

 

[Bob Dylan]

This is the same arguement that was used by Passenger Rail users in the 60s when the Class Is were doing their "Train offs" and "Run 'em off" Schemes.

AKA "The Slippery Slope!"

 

[crescent-zephyr]

You're not allowed to post that lol. You're gonna have the food critics jumping down your
throat. I've never been a big fan of the community seating either and I like the idea of a sleepers lounge. I would like to see more variety in the choices offered. It's fine for the CL/LSL where it's basically one meal and a breakfast but the Crescent and Silver trains have a longer run. But it's not that big a deal to me. The hysteria over it is kind of funny.

It does honestly surprise me that anyone who has tried the contemporary dining would have anything good to say about the quality of the meals and the number of options. Even if you like cheap TV dinners, you have to know that there is something better right?

The service model, when directly compared to what was there before, has some pros and cons.

I’ll continue to say I wish they would have kept the chef and the old menu and just eliminated the table service. They still could have laid off all the servers. They could have continued selling at your seat dining car meals to Coach passengers too... wasn’t that a success? So why didn’t they expand it?

 

[jis]

They have presumably not laid off anyone since the same law explicitly disallows such an action. They have merely shifted the cost out of the F&B account.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

They have presumably not laid off anyone since the same law explicitly disallows such an action. They have merely shifted the cost out of the F&B account.

Well there are fewer employees working per train, but you are correct my wording was not accurate as I know my sca on the meteor was a long time dining car server.

So I should have said “they still could have cut the server positions from the train to save those costs”

 

[Barb Stout]

That's pretty much exactly how it worked out with our numbers as well. And since we're vegetarian, it's a far worse deal, since those foods cost less to begin with. Plus, they won't even guarantee that the plant-based items (Things like veggie-burgers) will be available for the duration of the trip. On the Acela line you can put in your request for those items ahead of time, but on the Star we'll just cross our fingers that they start with a decent supply and there isn't a huge demand.

I have been a vegetarian for almost 40 years and during those years I have observed no proportional cost savings in vegetarian food vs meat at restaurants. In fact, in recent years I have seen vegetarian items being more expensive. It would seem that the overhead costs blow away any differential pricing between meat and vegetarian items and I assume the same is true in this situation. As for Amtrak running out of vegetarian food items, I have been on a train where they ran out of veggie burgers, but the trains that offer the Asian noodle thing have not run out of that when I have been on them. To decrease the likelihood of the train running out of an item you want, try to get the earliest meal time.

It's much easier to be a vegetarian/vegan these days compared to when I started, but I had more self-discipline back then than I do now.

 

[mizmamie]

I rode the Silver Meteor recently (NYP-ORL-NYP) and have to say that the new flexible dining menu is pretty awful. I'm a vegetarian and ordered the Asian noodle bowl for dinner, which had been nuked into a rubbery blob. It was so bad that I skipped lunch the next day, and brought dinner for the ride home. Breakfast was the best meal, IMO. It's hard to mess up a cup of yogurt and a banana. Can't tell you how much I missed having eggs, grits, and toast (not to mention different meals at lunch and dinner). Other than this, the rides were an A+.

 

[user 14106]

I’ll continue to say I wish they would have kept the chef and the old menu and just eliminated the table service. They still could have laid off all the servers. They could have continued selling at your seat dining car meals to Coach passengers too... wasn’t that a success? So why didn’t they expand it?

I have said this before but I think the title of the remaining position is just semantics. The issue isn’t whether this employee is a chef or an LSA the issue is that it’s one employee. One employee would not be able to prepare the old menu and serve it unless constantly assisted by the sleeping car attendants essentially replacing the servers during meals. This employee also has to deal with cash and the books so LSA is the proper title - there is nothing saying an LSA can’t cook.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

I have said this before but I think the title of the remaining position is just semantics. The issue isn’t whether this employee is a chef or an LSA the issue is that it’s one employee. One employee would not be able to prepare the old menu and serve it unless constantly assisted by the sleeping car attendants essentially replacing the servers during meals. This employee also has to deal with cash and the books so LSA is the proper title - there is nothing saying an LSA can’t cook.

Then keep the Chef and 1 LSA but still drop the table service. The point is keep the menu / quality of food even if you need to cut the table service.

I realize it's not just the staff on the train... they are also saving money by closing the east coast dining car commissaries.

 

[user 14106]

Then keep the Chef and 1 LSA but still drop the table service. The point is keep the menu / quality of food even if you need to cut the table service.

I realize it's not just the staff on the train... they are also saving money by closing the east coast dining car commissaries.

I don’t disagree but I just meant that with only one staffer the old menu is unrealistic unless you also had a second staffer as you suggested.