Texas Eagle 421 (thru to LAX). Is this a sleeper?

[Way2Kewl]

I’ve noticed when the Texas Eagle pulled thru TXA, I don’t recognize the 421 sleeper. There were 4 cars behind the Lounge car. Normally I expect to see the 2 #21 coaches, then the 421 coach and the 421 sleeper on the end.

I’ve known the sleepers to have the “single” window (H room) below the bedrooms and have always identified the sleeper cars with this single window. I've used this in the past to identify which way the sleeper is facing.

Here’s a shot of 21/421 coming thru TXA today. This is a pic of the last 2 cars. Neither had the single window. Is this indeed a sleeper car in back?

 

[ehbowen]

Nothing says that the 421 cars have to be on the tail end, although that is the normal configuration. They can be switched out of the head or even the middle just as easily.

 

[Bob Dylan]

It's a Coach, the #421 Sleeper is switched in San Antonio along with the #421 Coach to the back of #1.

Normally in the Winter the #421/#422 Thru Cars are on the back of the consists, but not Always.

 

[Way2Kewl]

Hi Bob,
It sure looked like 4 coach cars following the lounge. I live in DAL and have booked the #421 sleeper several times when heading to LAX so I can sleep during the switch in SAS. I'm trying to figure out which of these 4 cars was the #421 sleeper as it came thru TXA?

 

[Way2Kewl]

Today it seemed normal running the loco, (no baggage-now normal) followed by the trans sleeper, #21 sleeper 2120 (bedrooms facing forward), then the diner, lounge and then 4 cars. Normally 3 coaches and a clearly visible sleeper on the tail.

As I watched the last 4 cars I didn’t spot any with a single window on bottom (Room H) that I typically use to determine which are the sleepers.
Booking says it’s running with a sleeper but I don’t recognize it.


Is there another Superliner sleeper configuration that does not have the single window on bottom. If so, it would be much appreciated if you can share how to spot.

TXA Cam 12 Hr DVR arrived at 5:53a CT

 

[AmtrakBlue]

21/421(29) had a coach on the end when it left CHI. I was on it to STL.

 

[ref5035]

It’s my understanding they add and remove a coach daily between St. Louis and Chicago ... I saw it when I was there ..

 

[Way2Kewl]

The cam is in TXA so the STL couch would have already been dropped off.
The TXA cam shows 4 passanger cars behind the lounge…
I’m assuming one was the #421 sleeper … I just don’t recognize which as none had the single window.
Mystery continues…

 

[Bob Dylan]

Often the #421/#422 Sleepers are on the front of the consist behind the Transdorm and in front of the Diner (CCC) with the Cutout Coach the last Car on the Train.( And the St Louis Coach isn't always Cutout in STL, it sometimes goes deadhead all the way to/from SAS.

In this case, the Transdorm is the #21/#22 Sleeper with the Revenue Sleeper #421/#422.

Think that's what happened here!

 

[F900ElCapitan]

Looking at the pic, the windows on the lower level have a lot of light coming from them and it doesn’t look like normal coach seating. My thoughts are this might be a coach/cafe car deadheading from Fort Worth. They use these cars on the Heartland Flyer and once in a while have to swap them out so they can do heavy maintenance when required. The twelve hour window on the video had passed when I saw the thread, are you sure there wasn’t a sleeper up front between the transition sleeper and the diner?

As for a different sleeper configuration, both Superliner 1’s and 2’s are configured the same minus some small differences in the restrooms. So no there are no sleepers without the H room window.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

Looking at the pic, the windows on the lower level have a lot of light coming from them and it doesn’t look like normal coach seating. My thoughts are this might be a coach/cafe car deadheading from Fort Worth. They use these cars on the Heartland Flyer and once in a while have to swap them out so they can do heavy maintenance when required. The twelve hour window on the video had passed when I saw the thread, are you sure there wasn’t a sleeper up front between the transition sleeper and the diner?

As for a different sleeper configuration, both Superliner 1’s and 2’s are configured the same minus some small differences in the restrooms. So no there are no sleepers without the H room window.

The last car, which I was in, had a room on one end that looked like a cafe, but it appeared it was being used for storage. I did see a guy offload a box when we were detraining in STL.

 

[Way2Kewl]

Often the #421/#422 Sleepers are on the front of the consist behind the Transdorm and in front of the Diner (CCC) with the Cutout Coach the last Car on the Train.( And the St Louis Coach isn't always Cutout in STL, it sometimes goes deadhead all the way to/from SAS.
In this case, the Transdorm is the #21/#22 Sleeper with the Revenue Sleeper #421/#422.
Think that's what happened here!

OK, got it. No #21 sleeper (with bedrooms) today.
BTW... My objective is to identify which way the sleepers are facing on the Western LD tains. I assumed I'd see 2 sleepers when they run #21/421.

Eagle THRU TXA Oct30 - Eng-Tran(instead of #21 sleeper-so no bedrooms)-Sleeper(#421-facing forward today)-Diner-Lounge-Coach-Coach-Coach-Coach

I checked Amtrak reservations for the next #21/421 out of CHI (Nov 1) and no bedrooms are listed on #21, only offering #421.
Also the following #21/421 Nov 3rd also lists no available Bedrooms, Family, or Accessible. Only Roomettes.
… may be seasonal rather than random.

Thanks for helping me figuring this out.
… I’ll go back to identifying Superliner sleepers (that offer bedrooms) as only one layout (single window on bottom as displayed in the pic above)

Thanks folks,

 

[F900ElCapitan]

The last car, which I was in, had a room on one end that looked like a cafe, but it appeared it was being used for storage. I did see a guy offload a box when we were detraining in STL.

Yep, they often times use these cars as the extra STL cars on the Texas Eagle (we had one added last Sept in STL on 22 and also on the return on 21 to STL only) and the Kansas City car on the Southwest Chief. But usually they are taken off the train at said locations. The exception is every now and then they send one (or a regular coach depending on what is needed) on to Fort Worth to swap out with the Heartland Flyer, which actually uses the lower level cafe for its trip to OKC. On a side note, these cars used to be standard in the Pacific Northwest on the Cascades before the Talgo’s arrived.

 

[F900ElCapitan]

OK, got it. No #21 sleeper (with bedrooms) today.
BTW... My objective is to identify which way the sleepers are facing on the Western LD tains. I assumed I'd see 2 sleepers when they run #21/421.

Eagle THRU TXA Oct30 - Eng-Tran(instead of #21 sleeper-so no bedrooms)-Sleeper(#421-facing forward today)-Diner-Lounge-Coach-Coach-Coach-Coach

I checked Amtrak reservations for the next #21/421 out of CHI (Nov 1) and no bedrooms are listed on #21, only offering #421.
Also the following #21/421 Nov 3rd also lists no available Bedrooms, Family, or Accessible. Only Roomettes.
… may be seasonal rather than random.

Thanks for helping me figuring this out.
… I’ll go back to identifying Superliner sleepers (that offer bedrooms) as only one layout (single window on bottom as displayed in the pic above)

Thanks folks,

To be honest I got a little messed up here. It is standard on 21/421 for the full (421) sleeper to be up front between the transition sleeper and the diner. It is only on 22 on the 422 days that the sleeper is sometimes put on the rear. They only do this when 2 is running late and they want to save time switching in San Antonio.

Also, when the 421/422 sleepers are running, they are always sold separately from 21/22. On those days the 21/22 sleeper space being sold is the transition sleeper, so no bedrooms only roomettes. And the 421/422 are the full sleepers which connect to the Sunset Limited.

 

[bratkinson]

In the last 15 years or so, I've ridden the 421/422 sleeper perhaps a dozen times or so. The times I've ridden between May and September, between CHI and SAS, the sleeper was always in the last position after the CHI-STL coach had been removed (or added Northbound). Between SAS and LAX, it's either been up front adjacent to the diner or in last position.

However, this past April, while Amtrak was still running 'off peak' consists, riding #422 LAX-CHI, waking up after leaving SAS, I was surprised to find the #422 sleeper next to the diner, and the trans dorm ahead of that! No baggage car, no #22 sleeper! Where the #422 coach was I don't know. I'd guess in last position.

Obviously, during off-peak periods, Amtrak cuts the #21/22 sleeper on 421/422 days as apparently, there is insufficient demand for a 2nd full sleeper between CHI and SAS. What I am surprised about is that there were 4 coaches on yesterdays' train. Perhaps, as posited above, the STL car ran through as a deadhead. It would save the cost of a switcher at STL and the added fuel expense to haul it to/from SAS is in someone elses' budget, not the 'station' budget.

 

[Way2Kewl]

To confirm, under a normal #21 or #421 consist, I should only expect to see one standard Superliner sleeper on any given day as it rolls thru TXA.
If it’s a combined #21/421 consist then the one standard Superliner sleeper is considered #421.

… and I can quit hunting for the second sleeper…

 

[F900ElCapitan]

In the last 15 years or so, I've ridden the 421/422 sleeper perhaps a dozen times or so. The times I've ridden between May and September, between CHI and SAS, the sleeper was always in the last position after the CHI-STL coach had been removed (or added Northbound). Between SAS and LAX, it's either been up front adjacent to the diner or in last position.

However, this past April, while Amtrak was still running 'off peak' consists, riding #422 LAX-CHI, waking up after leaving SAS, I was surprised to find the #422 sleeper next to the diner, and the trans dorm ahead of that! No baggage car, no #22 sleeper! Where the #422 coach was I don't know. I'd guess in last position.

Obviously, during off-peak periods, Amtrak cuts the #21/22 sleeper on 421/422 days as apparently, there is insufficient demand for a 2nd full sleeper between CHI and SAS. What I am surprised about is that there were 4 coaches on yesterdays' train. Perhaps, as posited above, the STL car ran through as a deadhead. It would save the cost of a switcher at STL and the added fuel expense to haul it to/from SAS is in someone elses' budget, not the 'station' budget.

I live in the DFW area and have seen the TE go through numerous times, but I’ll admit I’ve been more observant in the last two years. I also rode the train to Chicago and back in September. Sleeper wise I’ve never seen the train with more than the transition sleeper and one full sleeper any time of the year (not including deadhead moves), in fact it seems to run the same consist year round, transition sleeper, sleeper, diner/ccc, SSL, and 3 coaches. I’ve also never witnessed the sleeper on 21 to be on the rear of the train, every time it’s been up front and it’s only when it’s the 422 car on 22 is it sometimes on the rear (only when 2 is running late). The baggage car went away last winter and hasn’t returned.

 

[F900ElCapitan]

To confirm, under a normal #21 or #421 consist, I should only expect to see one standard Superliner sleeper on any given day as it rolls thru TXA.
If it’s a combined #21/421 consist then the one standard Superliner sleeper is considered #421.

… and I can quit hunting for the second sleeper…

Yes, that is correct, and the last coach will be the 421 coach.