The best worst train!?

[Joel N. Weber II]

I disagree. I take the MBTA every day to Boston from my surrounding suburb and people will stand rather than sit 5 across. In fact, sometimes the aisles are totally full of standers while the middle seats remain empty. I wish that my line had the double decker cars that I see on the south shore, but I'm not sure if the tunnel on my route limits the height of the cars.

I have seen someone claim that these days there are no height issues on the north side of the MBTA system with the bilevel coaches the MBTA owns. However, there have been issues with derailments through an interlocking when they've tried running bilevel coaches on the north side in the past.

However, that's sufficiently Nth hand information that it should be taken with a canister of salt.

(Where are there any north side tunnels?)

I assume the MBTA's plan when they get the new Rotem coaches is to start running bi-level cars everywhere and retire the old single level cars, but with ever increasing demand, the sensible thing is probably to keep running everything they have now and simply add the Rotem cars.

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

Commuter cars are supposed to be efficient, not comfortable. People prefer 5 across seating to standing, which is why they are used in high-volume systems.

Actually to my knowledge people hate the 5 across seating. I've seen more trains with 30 or 40 people standing, while most of the middle seats in the 3 person bench go empty.

Thats not what I see, I see often three clearly unrelated people sitting together on rush hour trains.

I think I have heard it said that New Yorkers' sense of personal space is smaller in a way that might very well explain why New Yorkers tolerate this and Bostonians don't.

 

[AlanB]

Commuter cars are supposed to be efficient, not comfortable. People prefer 5 across seating to standing, which is why they are used in high-volume systems.

Actually to my knowledge people hate the 5 across seating. I've seen more trains with 30 or 40 people standing, while most of the middle seats in the 3 person bench go empty.

Thats not what I see, I see often three clearly unrelated people sitting together on rush hour trains.

I think I have heard it said that New Yorkers' sense of personal space is smaller in a way that might very well explain why New Yorkers tolerate this and Bostonians don't.

New Yorker's don't tolerate this either. I've seen many, many trains where there were standees and plenty of empty middle seats.

 

[amamba]

(Where are there any north side tunnels?)
I assume the MBTA's plan when they get the new Rotem coaches is to start running bi-level cars everywhere and retire the old single level cars, but with ever increasing demand, the sensible thing is probably to keep running everything they have now and simply add the Rotem cars.

There is a tunnel on the Newburyport/Rockport line between Swampscott and Salem. The tunnel is underneath Washington Street in Salem. The line also becomes only one track at some point in Salem through the tunnel and then through Salem and over the bridge into Beverly rather than dual track, so this is a point where there are often issues with the trains.

 

[HP_Lovecraft]

I read somewhere that MBTA just purchased 75 new Rotem bilevel trains for the North Station rails.

They are slighly smaller then the bi-level Kawasaki trains used from the South Station, maybe so they can fit in tunnels?

Below the MBTA specifically states that they will be upgrading the Newburyport line with Bi level trains:

Here is the MBTA link

 

[amamba]

I read somewhere that MBTA just purchased 75 new Rotem bilevel trains for the North Station rails.They are slighly smaller then the bi-level Kawasaki trains used from the South Station, maybe so they can fit in tunnels?

Below the MBTA specifically states that they will be upgrading the Newburyport line with Bi level trains:

Here is the MBTA link

Thanks for posting that report, which I actually I had read parts of before. I would like to see specifically somehwere in the news where they said that they actually purchased 75 rotem coaches for the north shore recently, because that report is full of fanciful thinking and plans, not concrete things that they are doing because they have money to do it. I did notice that it said that the bilevel coaches would be in place by 2020, which is a long time of standing on the train to/from Boston everyday. However, even just increasing the trainsets by one car would make a huge difference.

For example, many of the "short term" improvements in that report, such as an MBTA parking garage in Salem, are probably 5+ years away. I know that the Beverly one is finally moving forward because the state of Massachusetts has provided funding for it, but the Salem one is still far away, even though the new courthouse is under construction already with NO parking. The parking in Salem is so bad that people park all along the North River in a flood plain along Bridge Street everyday.

I think the most fanciful parts of the study are the ferry service and additional station suggestions. Sure, they'll do a ferry from Lynn to Boston, just like they are going to extend the blue line. Maybe in 20 years

 

[Ryan]

Commuter cars are supposed to be efficient, not comfortable. People prefer 5 across seating to standing, which is why they are used in high-volume systems.

Actually to my knowledge people hate the 5 across seating. I've seen more trains with 30 or 40 people standing, while most of the middle seats in the 3 person bench go empty.

Thats not what I see, I see often three clearly unrelated people sitting together on rush hour trains.

I think I have heard it said that New Yorkers' sense of personal space is smaller in a way that might very well explain why New Yorkers tolerate this and Bostonians don't.

New Yorker's don't tolerate this either. I've seen many, many trains where there were standees and plenty of empty middle seats.

To add another data point, I very rarely see folks standing in MARC's single level cars until all the 3rd middle seats are filled.

 

[Guest_Zoltán_*]

I would be extremely interested to see the designs you come up with!

It's a delightful coincidence that as I write this, I have a few basic diagrams I've drawn of a design for new cars for the MARC's Brunswick Line, though only sketches of a far less advanced academic level as what you'll be working to produce.

 

[zoltan]

Do excuse me; the above was me, but... damnit, I'm new to this forum! And so I totally cocked up a comment and a thread before realising i wasn't logged in. D:

 

[HP_Lovecraft]

I would like to see specifically somehwere in the news where they said that they actually purchased 75 rotem coaches for the north shore recently, because that report is full of fanciful thinking and plans,

This is where I read it

But now that I read it again, it is a bit more vague and says

The MBTA Board of Directors today approved the purchase of 75 new bi-level commuter rail ...Rotem Corp. will deliver four coaches by the end of 2010 with the remaining 71 coaches slated for delivery by 2012

So, the key part is "Approved the purchase". That might just be wishful thinking. Though I see they have already assigned the numbers: 800-846

and 1800-1827. Maybe that will tell you where they plan on using them?