The good ole days are back

[battalion51]

They will handle this on based on your circumstances, whatever suits you best is what will happen.

 

[railman]

The connection from train 30 to train 91 has been "broken" for the duration of the altered schedules, and Amtrak is telling passengers that it will not be guaranteed. Amtrak requires a minimum of 90 minutes between these two trains to consider it "guaranteed".

If you keep your itinerary with a connection from 30 to 91 be forewarned that it is at your own risk, according to Amtrak. The only options are an overnight stay somewhere in the Northeast or a circuitous routing from Chicago to New Orleans to Jacksonville to Columbia.

 

[battalion51]

It seems to me like Amtrak should be making some effort for PAX's with perviously made reservations by keeping that Guaranteed Connection for them. Who's to say that they would've booked the trip if there were no Guaranteed Connection. If I were you bsmith, I'd be crying foul when Amtrak calls you with the official change in schedule.

 

[railman]

On the face of it, I'd say I agree with you, batalion51. But the condition that Amtrak was forced to agree to was to get the Star outta Washington on-time or it gets hosed in Savannah by CSX for who-knows-how-long....

I guess I'd rather know up front that the connection is no good instead of cooling my heels for 8-12 hours in Savannah waiting for CSX to re-open the line to traffic.

 

[AlanB]

Amtrak requires a minimum of 90 minutes between these two trains to consider it "guaranteed".

Since when? :unsure:

The only trains that Amtrak requires 90 minutes for a guarateed connection are between arriving long distance trains and NEC trains. Silver Service may run on the NEC, but it is not considered a NEC train.

Additionally, Amtrak should have informed B. Smith that they were breaking that connection when they called to inform him of the changes to the Silver Service.

 

[battalion51]

Alan, nothing is official yet, this is all heresay, rumor, etc. Now granted we KNOW this will happen, but none of this has been set in stone yet. Until jobs go up for bid this Friday everything is still subject to change.

 

[AlanB]

Alan, nothing is official yet, this is all heresay, rumor, etc. Now granted we KNOW this will happen, but none of this has been set in stone yet. Until jobs go up for bid this Friday everything is still subject to change.

Well Amtrak is currently selling tickets for the combined trains on the new schedule. Addition, they are already calling passengers whose trips are being changed. There would be no point in calling people to tell them about the change, if it were still subject to further change.

So I'd say that it's pretty much a done deal.

Amtrak has already called BSmith to inform him of the change to his Silver Service train. So again why make two phone calls and change things twice? :unsure:

 

[bsmith]

I'm the guy booked on the "Super Train" on the 25th out of DC. When I talked to the Agent helping me, I asked if the connection was guaranteed and he relpied "YES". I can only assume he knows what he's talking about. B)

 

[Amtrak OBS Employee]

Alan, nothing is official yet, this is all heresay, rumor, etc. Now granted we KNOW this will happen, but none of this has been set in stone yet. Until jobs go up for bid this Friday everything is still subject to change.

It will be done, it has had WAY TOO MUCH publicity on the inside! Just like the situation with "The Palmetto Bug" a couple of years ago. :lol:

 

[Anthony]

The "Super Train" is definitely not just a "rumor".

 

[Amtrak OBS Employee]

The "Super Train" is definitely not just a "rumor".

OH OK.............. Better said!!!!! :lol:

 

[Amtrak OBS Employee]

Wow........Didn't take long for Trains magazine to get the news!!! :lol:

http://www.trains.com/Content/Dynamic/Arti...05/059encvo.asp

 

[railman]

"The only trains that Amtrak requires 90 minutes for a guarateed connection are between arriving long distance trains and NEC trains. Silver Service may run on the NEC, but it is not considered a NEC train."

This is an over generalization. Different trains can have different minimum connect-time requirements. For example, the Texas Eagle inbound to Chicago requires a minimum of 2 hours to guarantee a connection to anything, Converely, some trains require much less time, like NJT train arriving in Philadelphia for connections to Amtrak NEC trains -- they require as little as 20 minutes.

Right now, trains 30 and 91 have a 90-minute minimum connect time parameter in order for Amtrak to offer the guaranteed connection. The temporary schedule of train 91 only provides for 1'17" - therefore it's not guaranteed.

The agent who told the customer that the connection will be guaranteed was mistaken if the customer is traveling on the 'Super Train' altered schedule.

 

[Amfleet]

So the Silver Star will become a “super train” consisting of 2 locomotives and 16 cars: 6 coaches, 4 sleeping cars, 2 dining cars, 1 lounge car, 2 baggage cars, and 1 crew car. To accommodate the expanded train and larger passenger loads, Amtrak will also add extra staff.

While it's a heafty consist, 1 lounge car seems to be to little to handle 6 coaches. Come meal times the place will be packed, even with two attendants on hand at the snack bar. Also, 1 crew dorm doesn't seem enough to hold all crew members. Between the two diners that's 10 employees, add 1-2 lounge attendants, and 2-3 coach attendants, that's 12-15 crew members compared to the usual 7-8. The capacity of a crew dorm is 10.

Beginning April 24, train 91, the southbound Silver Star, will leave New York’s Penn Station at 9:45 a.m. with a scheduled arrival into Miami the next day at 3:38 p.m. Beginning April 25, train 92 will leave Miami at 8:35 a.m. with a scheduled arrival into New York’s Penn Station the next day at 2:30 p.m.

So when is the change? I've heard it's April 23 from Amtrak, but Trains sayts it's the 24th?

 

["Super Train" crew]

Amfleet, I agree with you about the one lounge -- it's insufficient to handle the expected passenger loads. Hopefully the two diners will do a brisk business and feed the majority of passengers looking for meal service (not snacks).

The single dorm car is unable to accommodate all the extra crew. The overflow (totalling 4 employees) is being protected in revenue sleeper space in one of the Viewliner sleeping cars.

 

[AlanB]

"The only trains that Amtrak requires 90 minutes for a guarateed connection are between arriving long distance trains and NEC trains. Silver Service may run on the NEC, but it is not considered a NEC train."
This is an over generalization.  Different trains can have different minimum connect-time requirements.  For example, the Texas Eagle inbound to Chicago requires a minimum of 2 hours to guarantee a connection to anything,  Converely, some trains require much less time, like NJT train arriving in Philadelphia for connections to Amtrak NEC trains -- they require as little as 20 minutes.

Right now, trains 30 and 91 have a 90-minute minimum connect time parameter in order for Amtrak to offer the guaranteed connection.  The temporary schedule of train 91 only provides for 1'17" - therefore it's not guaranteed.

First off, with respect, but that isn't a generalization. That is word for word from the Amtrak timetable. So if what you say is true, then Amtrak should remove that wording from the timetable. Otherwise they are just leaving themselves wide open for trouble and angry customers.

Next, your 2 hour window for Eagle connections in Chicago is not correct. I can book a connecting train from an arriving Eagle in CHI to train #391. This is a layover of only 1 hour and 40 minutes. The coach fare for this connection costs $136 and Amtrak does not price connections that are not guarenteed.

Heck they wouldn't even sell me a round trip ticket on the Wolverine/Twilight Limited, since there wasn't an hour to connect. The Wolverine turns as the Twlight in Pontiac, so the connection is guarenteed. Granted no one but a railfan would ever want to book such a trip, after all why would anyone else want to spend only 30 minutes in Pontiac.

The agent who told the customer that the connection will be guaranteed was mistaken if the customer is traveling on the 'Super Train' altered schedule.

On this point however, I will now agree with you. I've seen positive confirming documentation stating that Amtrak will not guarentee this connection for the duration of the Super Train.

So BSmith, get Amtrak back on the phone as you could be in big trouble if the Capitol is late. If at all possible I would suggest either starting your trip from Chicago one day earlier and overnighting in DC. Otherwise I would highly recomend delaying your departure on the the Silver Super Train out of DC by one day. Bottom line try to find some way to stay overnight in DC, rather than roll the dice on this connection.

It is a shame however that Amtrak did not give out the proper info from the start on this one. :angry: Hopefully they are calling the other people with such a connection, who may not be reading this website.

 

[AlanB]

Beginning April 24, train 91, the southbound Silver Star, will leave New York’s Penn Station at 9:45 a.m. with a scheduled arrival into Miami the next day at 3:38 p.m. Beginning April 25, train 92 will leave Miami at 8:35 a.m. with a scheduled arrival into New York’s Penn Station the next day at 2:30 p.m.

So when is the change? I've heard it's April 23 from Amtrak, but Trains sayts it's the 24th?

Amfleet,

That actually still seems to be a matter of debate, even in arrow. Most stories seem to go with the 24th being the first soutbound and the 25th being the first northbound.

That said however, here's how things breakdown on arrow.

April 22nd:

All trains run normally

April 23rd:

91: Leaves NYP at normal time. (No bedrooms left. Appears like they moved 97's pax to this train, but without 97's cars.)

92: Leaves MIA at normal time.

97: Appears to be cancelled. (Does not show up in arrow at all.)

98: Leaves MIA at normal time. Sold out completely*.

April 24th:

91: Leaves NYP at new time.

92: Leaves MIA at normal time. Sold out completely*.

97: Combined with 91.

98: Leaves MIA at normal time. Sold out completely*.

April 25th:

91: Leaves NYP at new time.

92: Leaves MIA at new time.

97: Combined with 91.

98: Combined with 92.

* All trains marked with an asterisk are sold out. While it is a weekend and therfore possible that they really are sold out, I do have to wonder if they are simply blacked out either due to an error or if they are waiting for some final confirmation.

 

[Amfleet]

Acutally, it seems the 23rd is a positioning day with #97's equipment staying in New York possibly to be added to the next days rescheduled #91.

 

[AlanB]

Acutally, it seems the 23rd is a positioning day with #97's equipment staying in New York possibly to be added to the next days rescheduled #91.

You may well be correct. That thought had occured to me too. And it would make sense, as the equipment arriving on the 24th would not arrive in time for the departure of the combined train on the 24th. So you would either need the 23rd's 98 equipment or you would need to send some spare equipment (if any exists) to NY.

I guess this will also break the run through between the Star and the Lake Shore Limited too.

 

[railman]

Next, your 2 hour window for Eagle connections in Chicago is not correct. I can book a connecting train from an arriving Eagle in CHI to train #391. This is a layover of only 1 hour and 40 minutes. The coach fare for this connection costs $136 and Amtrak does not price connections that are not guarenteed.

I don't know how you managed to get such a connection unless it was from train 322 to train 391. If the 'real' Texas Eagle is more than two hours late, the St Louis cars are operated as a separate on-time section, so that could explain how you could get such a connection with less than 2 hours between trains.

When I asked for San Antonio to Carbondale I got train 22 connecting to train 59, with a 5'35" layover.

 

[Foodman53]

According to TRAINS Magazine Online. #91 will add stops in Jesup, GA and Okeechobee, FL....but, will not stop in Trenton, NJ. My question is WHY?? Why would you forfeit a stop in the capital city of the 7th or 8th largest state, which has always been a regular stop?

Just curious...

From the "Florida Funnel"

Foodman53

 

[Amfleet]

According to TRAINS Magazine Online. #91 will add stops in Jesup, GA and Okeechobee, FL....but, will not stop in Trenton, NJ. My question is WHY?? Why would you forfeit a stop in the capital city of the 7th or 8th largest state, which has always been a regular stop?
Just curious...

From the "Florida Funnel"

Foodman53

That must be a mistake because ARROW is still showing 91/92 stopping in Trenton.

 

[battalion51]

The only possible reasons I can come up with for not stopping in Trenton is because of the way the train falls into the scheduling, there could be an Express right behind them, or they might not be able to stop since it's rush hour and NJT/SEPTA need the platform space.

 

[AlanB]

The only possible reasons I can come up with for not stopping in Trenton is because of the way the train falls into the scheduling, there could be an Express right behind them, or they might not be able to stop since it's rush hour and NJT/SEPTA need the platform space.

I strongly suspect that it's the later reason, coupled with one additional reason. Aside from not fitting on the platform, a train that long would probably also tie up the interlocking plants either right before the station or right after the station.

With both NJT & SEPTA needing to cross those interlockings, plus of course Amtrak, things could get interesting.

 

[Foodman53]

Again, I've not travelled by train in the NE in over a quarter century, so, changes to the infrastructure could have taken place....but, we routinely placed 18-20 car consists on all NE Corridor stations, Trenton included.

Unless it's because of some really mitigating circumstances like the above, I'd still question the wisdom of not stopping, particulalrly in a time of year of reasonably heavy ridership.

From the "Florida Funnel"

Foodman53