Trains v. Tornadoes

[northnorthwest]

After hearing about some delays and cancellations due to extreme weather, specifically tornadoes, I was wondering how Amtrak does against these beasts, especially compared to flights. With the increase in extreme weather caused by global warming, do we foresee a future where train travel is more practical than flights?

 

[AmtrakBlue]

Train dispatchers are aware of weather and will hold trains that may be headed towards the path of a tornado till the threat is gone. I'm sure they give slow orders to proceed due to possibility of downed trees and wires, etc on the tracks.

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

As AmtrakBlue explained weather movements are all controlled by the Host RR Dispatch and Amtrak is subject to the same delays as the Host's own trains. At least unlike an airliner being delayed, you can get up and walk around, eat, visit and relax.

 

[CCC1007]

A few years ago I read in trains magazine that the southwest chief was held eight miles east of a town in the Midwest for an accuweather tornado warning, and the engineer watched the tornado march through the town where his train would have been if the dispatcher had not told him to wait. Talk about a close call!

 

[tim49424]

I had a close call while on the Texas Eagle a couple of months ago. Just outside San Marcos, TX we were stopped due to the issuance of a couple tornado warnings. One tornado made its way up the I-35 corridor and hit and knocked out a wall at the high school in SM. We were stranded at and near the train station for nearly 30 hours waiting for the flood waters to subside as the storm deposited about 15 inches of rain in 6 hours. We were subsequently bussed to Fort Worth as the train returned to San Antonio due to the many washouts on the track northward.

 

[TylerP42]

Last night there was an extremely delayed Wolverine due to downed wire.

 

[Hytec]

We (Sunset Limited #1) were held somewhere in mid-Texas while a severe thunderstorm passed over the tracks about 10 miles ahead. We started moving slowly after about 15 minutes. Then a short while later saw a massive, and very black storm cloud 5-10 miles distant moving away rapidly.

Having seen what a tornado can do to freight cars as seen by a rear-facing locomotive camera, I was very glad that the dispatcher and our engineer were cautious.

 

[tim49424]

I wondered about the Wolverine last night because there was a F-1 tornado in Canton (between Ann Arbor and Detroit).

 

[TylerP42]

There was a tornado in Noblesville (Where the Indiana Transportation Museum is) and they were running their Polar Bear Express at the time.

 

[fairviewroad]

With the increase in extreme weather caused by global warming, do we foresee a future where train travel is more practical than flights?

Wishful thinking, IMO. Train tracks are susceptible to many problems caused by extreme weather: flooding, landslides, downed trees (and as others on this thread have shown, tornadoes). While airports are also susceptible to weather-related delays (obviously), a plane en route somewhere can many times simply divert around bad weather in its way. Trains almost never have have that option.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

Having seen what a tornado can do to freight cars as seen by a rear-facing locomotive camera, I was very glad that the dispatcher and our engineer were cautious.

That's a pretty interesting video. I would have (wrongly) thought the risk with a tornado would be all secondary; debris on the track. I didn't think that cars could actually be blown right off the track.

 

[CCC1007]

Here in Montana, the builder was blown off the track in the 80's, and several freight trains have been blown over, including one in east glacier where the cars from that train almost crushed the station building.

 

[MattW]

With the increase in extreme weather caused by global warming, do we foresee a future where train travel is more practical than flights?

Could we keep to real science please? There appears to be more cooling than warming right now, and the weather by the numbers is less extreme.

 

[BCL]

With the increase in extreme weather caused by global warming, do we foresee a future where train travel is more practical than flights?

Could we keep to real science please? There appears to be more cooling than warming right now, and the weather by the numbers is less extreme.

"Global warming" is somewhat of a clumsy phrase. However, there is a difference between weather and climate change.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

Could we keep to real science please? There appears to be more cooling than warming right now, and the weather by the numbers is less extreme.

More cooling? It was about 30deg warmer on Christmas. I was outside in my shirtsleeves, instead of a parka.

"Global warming" is that the average is slowly increasing, plus there are more drastic extremes in weather (extremes like Christmas in the 70's).

 

[MattW]

Could we keep to real science please? There appears to be more cooling than warming right now, and the weather by the numbers is less extreme.

More cooling? It was about 30deg warmer on Christmas. I was outside in my shirtsleeves, instead of a parka.

"Global warming" is that the average is slowly increasing, plus there are more drastic extremes in weather (extremes like Christmas in the 70's).

Wait, I thought you couldn't use weather to make claims about climate?

 

[BCL]

Could we keep to real science please? There appears to be more cooling than warming right now, and the weather by the numbers is less extreme.

More cooling? It was about 30deg warmer on Christmas. I was outside in my shirtsleeves, instead of a parka.

"Global warming" is that the average is slowly increasing, plus there are more drastic extremes in weather (extremes like Christmas in the 70's).

Wait, I thought you couldn't use weather to make claims about climate?

No. It's that individual weather events don't point out which way climate change is going, but climate change results in extreme weather conditions.

 

[Ryan]

Can we leave the head in the sand anti-science BS aside and get back to talking about weather and not climate? Maybe?

 

[KmH]

With the increase in extreme weather caused by global warming, do we foresee a future where train travel is more practical than flights?

Has anyone ever proposed in recent times that train travel can ever become more practical than air travel?

Airplanes can fly around storms.

Trains don't have that flexibility since they can only go where there are train tracks.

If we ever get a high speed cross country rail system those trains will have even fewer options for detouring around bad weather and other infrastructure problems.

 

[MattW]

But the weather effects are far far FAR less than on train than on planes. Does Amtrak have to detour around a little thunderstorm? No. Do planes? Yes!

 

[BCL]

But the weather effects are far far FAR less than on train than on planes. Does Amtrak have to detour around a little thunderstorm? No. Do planes? Yes!

The effects are of a different nature. Flooding can wash out tracks. Fallen trees and debris can block rails. Those aren't typical issues at airports.

Planes don't typically detour around thunderstorms. They will if there's a hurricane or tornado activity. Also - planes can fly above the weather and land someplace else.

 

[fairviewroad]

Not to mention a thunderstorm is fleeting. You fly over it, around it, or simply wait it out.

A landslide or washout can take days to repair.

It can take more than a decade to restore service that's been, ahem, "suspended" after a major hurricane.

 

[west point]

Only an idiot pilot would fly thru any thunderstorm. A Southern airlines DC-9 just flew close to one in north Georgia Result a crash that killed almost everyone. This pilot has turned around more than once due to a line of thunderstorms.

The second idiot activity would be to try to fly over a thunderstorm. Remember a thunderstorm has updrafts that can go to 60,000 feet but usually only 40,000 feet. But there is no way to tell where they top out.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Since we have several Airline and Military pilot members it would be interesting to read their comments re thunderstorms and severe weather!

(I'm a lowly Commercial Pilot/ASMEL and Instrument Rated, but don't fly anymore due to expense and for health reasons)