Amenities Being Eliminated from Long Distance Routes

[nferr]

So, and I mean this nicely, are you advocating that Amtrak "First Class" be equivalent to Motel 6?

Interestingly, Motel 6 offers:

Amenities Available at Every Motel 6 Location:

Kids Stay Free** [Half price on Amtrak]

Pets Welcome [Not on Amtrak, though the occasional hamster is okay]

Free Expanded Cable [Not on Amtrak]

Free Local Phone* [Amtrak operates on a "bring your own phone" basis]

Free Morning Coffee [The one and only amenity that Motel 6 shares with LD trains ]

Wi-Fi Internet Access*** [Not on Amtrak LD trains, except spotty service on the PPC]

I've never seen a motel six that rolled cross country. Have you?

 

[tonys96]

Reading a newspaper (a good one, that is) isn't a way to simply find out "what has happened in the past 24 hours" but rather to enjoy a good read, interesting perspectives, feature stories, etc.

It would be interesting to read those things in a newspaper, but unfortunately Amtrak provided USA Today, so your point is moot.

On our CS/EB trip this summer, we got a local paper from Klamath Falls, and somewhere else, maybe Minot?

 

[domefoamer]

Next time I'm booked on a train with Diner I guess I could run down to the Dollar Store or Hobby Lobby and pick up a few inexpensive plastic flowers in vases and leave them in the Diner. If enough of us did that we could repopulate all the Diners system wide :unsure: ^_^

That's exactly what I plan to do when I take the CZ and CS next month! I hope the diner staff gets a kick out of that.

I suspect that the wine tasting was the biggest target here, sounding like an effete, elite amenity. Fine, charge $5 for it. The soap and shampoo bags are just something you expect-- I can't recall the last motel that lacked this, and I usually choose the cheaper places. Newspapers have gotten quite expensive, sometimes $2 per copy, and I see how that would add up. Of all these perks, I'd expect it was the most expensive. I'd rather have a local newspaper anyway, so I hope they remain available at major stations.

Of all the deleted amenities, it's those little table flowers that agitate me the most. You ought to get a week's worth of use out of an average artificial flower, at least. That week might include 18 meal seatings x 4 people. So seventy-two folks get enjoyment from that puny little 50-cent flower. Give me a break!

 

[zepherdude]

When I first joined this fine group, all anyone could talk about was the loss of service from Orlando to New Orleans, what train is that, Sunset Limited. Massive indignation, riots, hell fire and brimstone. Everyone was stoning Peter Gunn and vowing never to ride Amtrak again. Well, we made it through that. We do not like stuff taken away, we don't like plastic plates, we don't like the lack of linen, we don't like the menu, now we don't like the high tea service gone where we all get a free glass of wine. I suspect this entire issue will be forgotten two months after it is pulled.

I have only seen this issue discussed here and members on other boards really hate everything. To me, this is all about cost efficiency and maybe better cross utilization of staff and food and beverage products, plus the need for an extra clean-up in the dining car. Maybe fifty other reasons I can't think of. Does no one think this issue was discussed for months and offered to focus groups and cost accounting measured. Do you think all the big dogs got together one night at Joe's and said GET RID OF IT!!! This was planned and all this issues discussed here were discussed.

Everyone takes things so personal, so slap in the face like. Its not personal at all, its business. Airlines now tell unhappy passengers that they are free to fly another airline. Same here, you are free to travel another train. For my part, when I upgrade to a roomette, I get what I pay for.

 

[domefoamer]

newspapers with 12 to 24 hour old news.

Have you ever read a book? Because the material in there is sometimes years, even decades old.

Reading a newspaper (a good one, that is) isn't a way to simply find out "what has happened in the past 24 hours" but rather to

enjoy a good read, interesting perspectives, feature stories, etc.

I love to see local newspapers when I travel, to get some of the flavor of the communities passing by outside the windows. Those feature stories, police blotter items, and city council debates rarely make it to the internet, and are hard to find. It's part of the whole idea of travel, and being in a different place for a while.

 

[greatcats]

Just reading the SP buffet car menu. I could go for the $1.00 martini.

 

[railiner]

Speaking of amenities....not having travelled in a sleeper for quite a while, I was wondering if they still provided a "bedtime sweet"? In the past, a couple of chocolate mints.

If they have eliminated them, I wonder if Corporate would frown if an enterprising sleeper attendant would purchase and distribute them at his or her own expense?

A cheap investment that could pay nice dividends in tips at the end of the run for that attendant. I could see them against it for possible product liability issues, or passenger's receiving them expecting them all the time, and then complaining if not getting them.......

 

[PRR 60]

Speaking of amenities....not having travelled in a sleeper for quite a while, I was wondering if they still provided a "bedtime sweet"? In the past, a couple of chocolate mints.

If they have eliminated them, I wonder if Corporate would frown if an enterprising sleeper attendant would purchase and distribute them at his or her own expense?

A cheap investment that could pay nice dividends in tips at the end of the run for that attendant. I could see them against it for possible product liability issues, or passenger's receiving them expecting them all the time, and then complaining if not getting them.......

Yes, they would frown upon that just as they prohibit chefs from adding self-purchased spices and other items to the standard recipes. The issue is food safety and liability. Amtrak is responsible for the safety of all food served by Amtrak staff. Accordingly, Amtrak only allows food items that it approves and purchases.

 

[Nathanael]

Everyone takes things so personal, so slap in the face like. Its not personal at all, its business. Airlines now tell unhappy passengers that they are free to fly another airline.

And I stopped flying entirely.

It's just business.

You can run the business competently. Or you can use the airline business model, which is one of going bankrupt every few years and demanding a bailout, while driving away customers, and meanwhile claiming that you are a for-profit competitive business. I personally have little or no respect for that business model.

 

[Nathanael]

Yes, they would frown upon that just as they prohibit chefs from adding self-purchased spices and other items to the standard recipes. The issue is food safety and liability. Amtrak is responsible for the safety of all food served by Amtrak staff. Accordingly, Amtrak only allows food items that it approves and purchases.

Which is fine, except... if you are paranoid about liability and enforce such a policy, then *you* the *corporate management* have to provide all the stuff which you don't allow the employees to provide themselves. Or throw away revenue.

The alternative is to have customers go away thinking that they're being overcharged.

People's reactions are weird -- it's well documented in the hospitality industry that a bunch of really cheap "frills" have a large effect on customers' perception of "value for money".

 

[roomette]

Speaking of amenities....not having travelled in a sleeper for quite a while, I was wondering if they still provided a "bedtime sweet"? In the past, a couple of chocolate mints.

If they have eliminated them, I wonder if Corporate would frown if an enterprising sleeper attendant would purchase and distribute them at his or her own expense?

A cheap investment that could pay nice dividends in tips at the end of the run for that attendant. I could see them against it for possible product liability issues, or passenger's receiving them expecting them all the time, and then complaining if not getting them.......

Yes, they would frown upon that just as they prohibit chefs from adding self-purchased spices and other items to the standard recipes. The issue is food safety and liability. Amtrak is responsible for the safety of all food served by Amtrak staff. Accordingly, Amtrak only allows food items that it approves and purchases.

I have had more than one SCA provide apples and bananas near the coffee.

 

[vacationer1954]

I see these things in the context of, "If they really wanted to save money, they'd cancel LD service (except in the northeast)." I'm not convinced that any of these amenities attract more revenue than they cost, and in the absence of that I don't have a good argument for keeping them.

http://www.brookings.edu/research/interactives/2013/AmtrakRoutes

 

[user 1215]

Speaking of amenities....not having travelled in a sleeper for quite a while, I was wondering if they still provided a "bedtime sweet"? In the past, a couple of chocolate mints.

If they have eliminated them, I wonder if Corporate would frown if an enterprising sleeper attendant would purchase and distribute them at his or her own expense?

A cheap investment that could pay nice dividends in tips at the end of the run for that attendant. I could see them against it for possible product liability issues, or passenger's receiving them expecting them all the time, and then complaining if not getting them.......

Yes, they would frown upon that just as they prohibit chefs from adding self-purchased spices and other items to the standard recipes. The issue is food safety and liability. Amtrak is responsible for the safety of all food served by Amtrak staff. Accordingly, Amtrak only allows food items that it approves and purchases.

I have had more than one SCA provide apples and bananas near the coffee.

And this is done at risk. Imagine a person getting sick. They call Amtrak. "Hey! Those bananas you have me in my sleeper car made me sick!" "We don't provide bananas." "Yes you do. I ate one, and I'm sick now." "Alrighty, what's train number and the name of your attendant?"
...

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S3 using the Android Amtrak Forums mobile app

 

[Anderson]

There are probably some ways around those issues, at least in part. For one, Amtrak could always encourage innovation through some process (i.e. put a pot of money out there to allow certain things to be attempted, but require a certain level of documentation and sourcing control; successful innovations get a bonus and get standardized).

On minor benefits, Amtrak really ought to consider trying to work up some studies showing "If we spend $5 per sleeper passenger on a wine tasting, we add X number of riders, can increase sleeper fares by Y, and can therefore effectively increase sleeper revenue by Z."

By the way, it's very likely Amtrak wasn't paying $2/paper. They likely had a bulk deal with their providers (after all, they were likely buying 50-100 papers/day in some cities, which isn't a trivial number...for The Forum (out of Fargo), 50 copies would be about 0.1% of total circulation. The Reno Gazette-Journal is a similar case. It's probably the same for a lot of the other smaller-town papers Amtrak uses in places: Amtrak could easily be one of their top ten clients. Likewise, with the USA Today, Amtrak likely gets a "hotel-style" bulk deal. Ditto the major papers on the NEC, for that matter. From what I can tell based on hotel prices, $.50-$.75/paper would be closer to Amtrak's price.

 

[KC Ghost Rider]

When I first joined this fine group, all anyone could talk about was the loss of service from Orlando to New Orleans, what train is that, Sunset Limited. Massive indignation, riots, hell fire and brimstone. Everyone was stoning Peter Gunn and vowing never to ride Amtrak again. Well, we made it through that. We do not like stuff taken away, we don't like plastic plates, we don't like the lack of linen, we don't like the menu, now we don't like the high tea service gone where we all get a free glass of wine. I suspect this entire issue will be forgotten two months after it is pulled.

I have only seen this issue discussed here and members on other boards really hate everything. To me, this is all about cost efficiency and maybe better cross utilization of staff and food and beverage products, plus the need for an extra clean-up in the dining car. Maybe fifty other reasons I can't think of. Does no one think this issue was discussed for months and offered to focus groups and cost accounting measured. Do you think all the big dogs got together one night at Joe's and said GET RID OF IT!!! This was planned and all this issues discussed here were discussed.

Everyone takes things so personal, so slap in the face like. Its not personal at all, its business. Airlines now tell unhappy passengers that they are free to fly another airline. Same here, you are free to travel another train. For my part, when I upgrade to a roomette, I get what I pay for.

Hmm...I did consider the whole paragraph and even the sentence as a whole, so I didn't take it out of context. However, the part I want to respond to is in bold. You may have gotten what you paid for. I get that. I paid for a roomette too, on the LSL, and the agent who sold me the ticket said I would be boarding the train early for a wine and cheese reception. This agent stated that this was done because there was no dinner service out of Chicago due to the hour. Therefore, I paid for the reception with my purchase of the roomette. I am not getting what I paid for. Usually, a responsible company will post an effective cut off date well in advance and warn a customer that after such and such a date this service will no longer be available. In my case, I brought it to Amtrak's Customer Relations people who had no clue that this was even happening. This was not posted on their FB page or at Amtrak.com as a service no longer offered. Until yesterday, the website still mentioned the wine and cheese receptions and the time table for the LSL mentioned the early boarding for drinks and snacks (We all know its wine and cheese). This is just bad business practice. It was done in secret. There was no phone calls, emails, or letters saying "Sorry, the following amenities will be discontinued on the following dates". No, someone posted a confidential company notice here and now we are discussing it. "I get what I pay for"...well, sir, you might have, but I certainly did not!

 

[rrdude]

When I first joined this fine group, all anyone could talk about was the loss of service from Orlando to New Orleans, what train is that, Sunset Limited. Massive indignation, riots, hell fire and brimstone. Everyone was stoning Peter Gunn and vowing never to ride Amtrak again. Well, we made it through that. We do not like stuff taken away, we don't like plastic plates, we don't like the lack of linen, we don't like the menu, now we don't like the high tea service gone where we all get a free glass of wine. I suspect this entire issue will be forgotten two months after it is pulled.

I have only seen this issue discussed here and members on other boards really hate everything. To me, this is all about cost efficiency and maybe better cross utilization of staff and food and beverage products, plus the need for an extra clean-up in the dining car. Maybe fifty other reasons I can't think of. Does no one think this issue was discussed for months and offered to focus groups and cost accounting measured. Do you think all the big dogs got together one night at Joe's and said GET RID OF IT!!! This was planned and all this issues discussed here were discussed.

Everyone takes things so personal, so slap in the face like. Its not personal at all, its business. Airlines now tell unhappy passengers that they are free to fly another airline. Same here, you are free to travel another train. For my part, when I upgrade to a roomette, I get what I pay for.

Hmm...I did consider the whole paragraph and even the sentence as a whole, so I didn't take it out of context. However, the part I want to respond to is in bold. You may have gotten what you paid for. I get that. I paid for a roomette too, on the LSL, and the agent who sold me the ticket said I would be boarding the train early for a wine and cheese reception. This agent stated that this was done because there was no dinner service out of Chicago due to the hour. Therefore, I paid for the reception with my purchase of the roomette. I am not getting what I paid for. Usually, a responsible company will post an effective cut off date well in advance and warn a customer that after such and such a date this service will no longer be available. In my case, I brought it to Amtrak's Customer Relations people who had no clue that this was even happening. This was not posted on their FB page or at Amtrak.com as a service no longer offered. Until yesterday, the website still mentioned the wine and cheese receptions and the time table for the LSL mentioned the early boarding for drinks and snacks (We all know its wine and cheese). This is just bad business practice. It was done in secret. There was no phone calls, emails, or letters saying "Sorry, the following amenities will be discontinued on the following dates". No, someone posted a confidential company notice here and now we are discussing it. "I get what I pay for"...well, sir, you might have, but I certainly did not!

Apples and bananas could well have been requested in the commissary before the trip, not unusual at all, for smaller amounts. I used to always ask, "Do you have anything I can take for comp service today" It was a mish-mash, but it often increased tips, and produced smiles.

 

[yarrow]

So, and I mean this nicely, are you advocating that Amtrak "First Class" be equivalent to Motel 6?

Interestingly, Motel 6 offers:

Amenities Available at Every Motel 6 Location:

Kids Stay Free** [Half price on Amtrak]

Pets Welcome [Not on Amtrak, though the occasional hamster is okay]

Free Expanded Cable [Not on Amtrak]

Free Local Phone* [Amtrak operates on a "bring your own phone" basis]

Free Morning Coffee [The one and only amenity that Motel 6 shares with LD trains ]

Wi-Fi Internet Access*** [Not on Amtrak LD trains, except spotty service on the PPC]

I've never seen a motel six that rolled cross country. Have you?

your point is??????

 

[Ryan]

The candidates for Amtrak's picture of the week on Facebook:

I wasn't the first in the comments to call them out on them taking that amenity away.

 

[afigg]

On the comments about this decision being made in "secret" and confusion at the customer center, we need to remember this information came from an leak of a snapshot of an internal memo to the OBS. The memo to the customer center staff and what they are to do in response to complaints about X amenity being dropped is still probably being drafted.

While I think the decision to drop the Wine & Cheese tasting is primarily a political move, most of the others appear to be simply (minor) cost cutting. The complementary newspapers probably don't cost much to provide, but the reality may be that there are a large number of unread newspapers at the end of the trip that have to be recycled. I may be one of the last people on my block who still gets a daily printed newspaper delivery (Washington Post), so I still read newspapers. But I recognize that fewer and fewer people read printed newspapers, so complementary printed newspapers are going to fade away, sooner or later. On the other hand, if the issue is too many unread newspapers, perhaps the solution should be to cut way back on the the number of copies ordered and number of different newspapers, rather than eliminate the newspapers entirely.

Trains Magazine News Wire has a story today on the termination of the LD train amenities with statements on how the decision was reached and why. Now, some of it is probably spin, but they claim the decision was made by the LD route directors, not at HQ. The News Wire story is behind a paywall for subscribers, so I will limit this to a short excerpt for the key points:

Amtrak spokesman Marc Magliari tells Trains News Wire, however, that the decision to cut amenities came from the route directors in Chicago, not a corporate directive from Washington, though the company “has made promises to stakeholders that we would continue to reduce costs.”

He adds, “The route directors felt these changes would have a minimal impact on passenger revenue while reducing some confusion in passengers expectations between riding the Coast Starlight or Empire Builder and other long-distance service. Like a hotel, we would still provide travel kits to passengers that need them.”

....

According to Magliari, there are no plans to stop running the Coast Starlight’s aging Pacific Parlour Cars, yet the wine tastings have clearly helped drive sleeping car occupancy and pricing for rooms that might otherwise be unoccupied on the all-day trip between Los Angeles and the San Francisco Bay Area.

 

[Anderson]

The issue with the "confusion" point is, of course, that Amtrak explicitly markets the Builder and Starlight as premium trains. There is supposed to be a difference! Talk about weak spin...

 

[Nathanael]

On the comments about this decision being made in "secret" and confusion at the customer center, we need to remember this information came from an leak of a snapshot of an internal memo to the OBS. The memo to the customer center staff and what they are to do in response to complaints about X amenity being dropped is still probably being drafted.

This is a problem, because the cut dates start on February 15th. If you haven't got your act together for updating your advertising & marketing and changing the customer services notices, you shouldn't make the changes -- and one week is FAR too short notice for a marketing department. FAR too short.

I've recently dealt with another company which has serious problems in communications. It's a very bad thing, and it's a habit Amtrak should *not* acquire. Customers will tolerate a lot if they're notified well in advance and know what's going on. "Stealth" changes are consistently very unpopular.

Amtrak has been having other communications failures as well. Are the Empire Builders still being detoured westbound? Apparently this detour started PRIOR to the publication of the service alert, which is now gone. Frequently, long distance trains are having multi-day disruptions with no service alert. This happened during the ice storms, when service alerts were put out which clearly explained the changes to corridor service, but didn't even describe the effects on long-distance service.

This isn't appropriate, and I'm sure someone in Amtrak knows it isn't appropriate. But there's some sort of communications failure in the organization.

 

[fairviewroad]

It would be interesting to read those things in a newspaper, but unfortunately Amtrak provided USA Today,

Not in my experience. As others have pointed out, local papers are frequently provided. I'm no fan of USA Today (though it seems to be the paper of choice for most hotels) but as I said, I can't recall ever getting one on Amtrak. I'm not saying it's never happened since obviously you must have a reason for saying that's what Amtrak provides. It's just I've never seen it. But I haven't traveled on most of the eastern LD trains, so my experience is limited.

Then, think about the delivery. A driver has to go to your location to drop off those 5 papers. His company probably also makes a little more per paper, but even if he was collecting all the money from that delivery - say, a dollar per paper, for 3 papers - how worthwhile is it to make that delivery stop for only three bucks?

As a data point, my local newspaper seems to think it's economically worthwhile to send a driver to deliver a single newspaper to my front door each morning. I realize that single paper represents a guaranteed sale, unlike the c-store papers. But that single paper represents less than one dollar in actual income, except on Sundays.

I don't disagree with your general point that the newspaper business is struggling. But that's a separate issue from whether it's a worthwhile amenity for Amtrak to provide to its first-class passengers. I know on the Cascades BC, the Seattle and Portland papers always seem to be read and passed around IME.

 

[Ryan]

On the comments about this decision being made in "secret" and confusion at the customer center, we need to remember this information came from an leak of a snapshot of an internal memo to the OBS. The memo to the customer center staff and what they are to do in response to complaints about X amenity being dropped is still probably being drafted.

This is a problem, because the cut dates start on February 15th. If you haven't got your act together for updating your advertising & marketing and changing the customer services notices, you shouldn't make the changes -- and one week is FAR too short notice for a marketing department. FAR too short.

They actually start tomorrow, but the 8 February (Cranberry Juice) and 15 February (Flowers) changes aren't that big (and aren't "advertised features"). The big stuff doesn't come until the end of March, so there's still plenty of time to get people up to speed.

Employees: All

Food Service Car/Type: Diner, Lounge, Cafè, Pacific Parlour Car, Diner Lite

Region: All

Train Specific: All Long Distance trains except the Auto Train

Issue Date: February 4, 2014

(EDIT: I'm leaving off the contact information, it's too hard to read.)

Background:

A number of amenity items are being eliminated and removed from long distance services.

Advisory:

The following amenity items are being eliminated and removed from long distance services. Effective dates are posted next to the items and the commissaries will stop boarding these items on these dates. Ending dates were set based on the calculated depletion of existing inventories.

• Wine & Cheese Receptions - Effective March 31, 2014Empire Builder
• Coast Starlight
• Lake Shore Ltd.

[*]Complimentary 187ml Champagne & Non-Alcoholic Cider - Effective March 31, 2014
[*]Aseptic Cranberry Juice will no longer be offered in the Sleeping Car - Effective February 8, 2014

• Orange and Apple will continue to be offered
• Dining car will continue to offer Cranberry Juice

[*]Complimentary Newspapers - Effective Date TBA. Research is underway regarding existing contracts in place with current vendors
[*]Amenity Kits - Effective May 31, 2014

• Empire Builder
• Coast Starlight

[*]Flowers and Vases on Dining Car Tables - Effective February 15, 2014
[*]Astor Chocolate Squares - Effective March 31, 2014

• Empire Builder
• Coast Starlight

Thank you for your cooperation.​

This Food Service Notice is fulfilled on April 1, 2014.​

 

[yarrow]

On the comments about this decision being made in "secret" and confusion at the customer center, we need to remember this information came from an leak of a snapshot of an internal memo to the OBS. The memo to the customer center staff and what they are to do in response to complaints about X amenity being dropped is still probably being drafted.

This is a problem, because the cut dates start on February 15th. If you haven't got your act together for updating your advertising & marketing and changing the customer services notices, you shouldn't make the changes -- and one week is FAR too short notice for a marketing department. FAR too short.

They actually start tomorrow, but the 8 February (Cranberry Juice) and 15 February (Flowers) changes aren't that big (and aren't "advertised features"). The big stuff doesn't come until the end of March, so there's still plenty of time to get people up to speed.

Employees: All

Food Service Car/Type: Diner, Lounge, Cafè, Pacific Parlour Car, Diner Lite

Region: All

Train Specific: All Long Distance trains except the Auto Train

Issue Date: February 4, 2014

(EDIT: I'm leaving off the contact information, it's too hard to read.)

Background:

A number of amenity items are being eliminated and removed from long distance services.

Advisory:

The following amenity items are being eliminated and removed from long distance services. Effective dates are posted next to the items and the commissaries will stop boarding these items on these dates. Ending dates were set based on the calculated depletion of existing inventories.

• Wine & Cheese Receptions - Effective March 31, 2014Empire Builder
• Coast Starlight
• Lake Shore Ltd.

[*]Complimentary 187ml Champagne & Non-Alcoholic Cider - Effective March 31, 2014
[*]Aseptic Cranberry Juice will no longer be offered in the Sleeping Car - Effective February 8, 2014

• Orange and Apple will continue to be offered
• Dining car will continue to offer Cranberry Juice

[*]Complimentary Newspapers - Effective Date TBA. Research is underway regarding existing contracts in place with current vendors
[*]Amenity Kits - Effective May 31, 2014

• Empire Builder
• Coast Starlight

[*]Flowers and Vases on Dining Car Tables - Effective February 15, 2014
[*]Astor Chocolate Squares - Effective March 31, 2014

• Empire Builder
• Coast Starlight

Thank you for your cooperation.​

This Food Service Notice is fulfilled on April 1, 2014.​

my understanding is that the amenities will disappear as existing supplies run out up to the effective date. thus i have read flowers are already gone on some trains as, i suppose, at the end of a run the existing supply has run out.

 

[Ryan]

That understanding doesn't square with the document you quoted.

Given that the amenities aren't offered 100% of the time, it's unsurprising that some trains don't have flowers.