Amtrak Initiates RFQ process for Texas High Speed Rail

[Cal]

Sorry if this has already been posted, but it looks like Amtrak has started the process to find a firm to provide "programmatic support for the development and execution of the Texas High Speed Rail Project." The document mentions at top speed of 205MPH for a 90 minute trip. I don't have a link to the full document, these are just from two small screenshots.

 

[Paniolo Man]

I'm surprised and happy that this project is still breathing.

I assume that since it is an Amtrak project now, Texas Central's plans to use JR Shinkansen equipment are probably out the window.

 

[Tom C]

This is what they hired Andy Byford to spearhead. Hope for success. This is a great market for Amtrak to try to build especially given the politics!

 

[Rover]

Sorry if this has already been posted, but it looks like Amtrak has started the process to find a firm to provide "programmatic support for the development and execution of the Texas High Speed Rail Project." The document mentions at top speed of 205MPH for a 90 minute trip. I don't have a link to the full document, these are just from two small screenshots.

I read about it here:

https://www.kbtx.com/2025/02/27/amt...vance-houston-dallas-high-speed-rail-project/

Amtrak appears to be gaining momentum as it moves forward with plans to develop a high-speed rail line between Dallas and Houston, launching a procurement process to select a Delivery Partner for the project.

Texas Rail Advocates first reported the latest development, which marks a significant step in advancing the long-planned rail line.

The Texas High-Speed Rail (HSR) Project promises to provide a 90-minute trip between the Lone Star State’s two largest cities, reaching up to 205 miles per hour along a 240-mile route that includes a stop in the Brazos Valley.

According to Amtrak, the delivery partner will be responsible for providing “advice, leadership, and support” to facilitate the execution of the project. According to the request, this firm will not design or construct the rail system, however, it will play a key role in program management, construction oversight, stakeholder coordination, procurement, and quality management.

Amtrak says the partner must be “aware of and willing to enter into incentive/disincentive compensation structures to ensure the Project is delivered in the most innovative and cost-efficient manner.”

 

[cirdan]

I wonder how much they are building on the previous Texas Central project versus throwing stuff out and starting from scratch.

 

[Bob Dylan]

As a Texan, I'm from Missouri on this one!( " Show Me!)

I'll believe it when I see it!

Considering the current State of Politics, both State and National, and the Huge Amount of Money involved, I wouldn't bet my House on this Scheme ever seeing the Light of Day!

 

[Maglev]

Dare I be optimistic and think that the current administration sees the real estate value of intercity passenger rail?

 

[OmahaRoad]

Dare I be optimistic and think that the current administration sees the real estate value of intercity rail?

I think that there's a small chance they do--at least in relation to private companies like Brightline. I could see this Texas project moving forward in some weird way, like if Duffy & the Trump Admin. insisted that Brightline (can't think of any other "real" private rail operator in the U.S. who would be close to equipped to do this) become a major partner in the project in order for it to receive funding, etc.

Obviously conjecture. But with success of Brightline Florida + Brightline West underway, I'd be a little surprised if they tried to, say, pull back the Federal dollars they received for the BL West project. I really could see them pushing Brightline/any sort of private model (or at least a Amtrak-private partnership model) but we'll see.

 

[NES28]

I forget the specifics but something I read after this announcement led me to believe that Amtrak is still committed to use of Shinkansen technology. The Japanese have invested a lot in the project, including after Amtrak involvement started.

 

[Cal]

Elon Musk replied to a fairly large post about the RFQ on Twitter (X) with a emoji. Take that as you will. I also believe today DOGE has reached the FRA.

 

[Anderson]

Elon Musk replied to a fairly large post about the RFQ on Twitter (X) with a emoji. Take that as you will. I also believe today DOGE has reached the FRA.

Clearly they just need to commit to using Tesla Powerwalls as a backup power source and the project will get cleared...

 

[George Harris]

First, IMHO, the Japanese know more about high-speed rail equipment, track, and operation than the various and sundry European and others that claim knowledge thereof will even begin to understand 10 years from now. So, I certainly hope that they stay with the Shinkansen equipment. Another not exactly incidental factor, due t6 the width of the Shinkansen cars, a platform built to give an ADA acceptable gap between platform and car floor will pass AAR standard width freight cars and equipment without need for any special games such as gantlet tracks. (The proper word is gantlet. A gauntlet is an armored glove. A gantlet is a tight passage, usually painful.)

Second, the Texas HSR is in a natural "sweet spot" for distance for a high-speed rail segment. By the time you deal with gate to gate you are essentially equal to rail in time and without the hassles inherent in air travel. Along with this, the terrain and geographt between end points is made for rail. Relatively flat, and without multiple intermediate population center or other major constraints.

 

[Tom C]

Given the challenges with CAHSR it’s right to be skeptical. I can see Amtrak’s interest in this particular market though for the reasons you mentioned. Also with the current politics you may have some of the powers that be a bit more sympathetic since it’s Texas.

 

[cirdan]

Clearly they just need to commit to using Tesla Powerwalls as a backup power source and the project will get cleared...

maybe Musk thinks a Hyperloop would be a better alternative? Good opportunity to put everything on hold while consultants make more money doing more feasability studies.

 

[cirdan]

a platform built to give an ADA acceptable gap between platform and car floor will pass AAR standard width freight cars and equipment

why should passing freight cars even be an issue? Surely this is a dedicated passenger corridor and there are existing freight corridors that will continue to exist.

 

[TheVig]

I've had a couple of days to marinate on this. So here is my two cents. Elon is a technology guy. He has broad interests beyond cars, rockets, and boring tunnels. I think if anybody could help sell the idea of a Shinkansen to Trump, it's Elon at the moment. I think it would be wise for Train Daddy and a few other higher ups at Amtrak to start scheduling some so called three hour lunches with Elon and and the FRA to explain the possibilities. Initial meetings don't need to have every stake holder with an opinion present either. After spending a few weeks in the beltway on non rail related stuff, I can assure you they are not interested in the noise of someone's romantic longing for the food and beverage options they had on trains in 1962. I don't think Amtrak is screwed for the next 4 years or beyond, it's just the salesmanship in justifying it's existence is going to have to be approached differently.

 

[allanorn]

Another not exactly incidental factor, due t6 the width of the Shinkansen cars, a platform built to give an ADA acceptable gap between platform and car floor will pass AAR standard width freight cars and equipment without need for any special games such as gantlet tracks. (The proper word is gantlet. A gauntlet is an armored glove. A gantlet is a tight passage, usually painful.)

Texas HSR only works as a passenger rail corridor. The Germans have more or less proven that mixed traffic on tracks capable of HSR doesn't scale capacity-wise.

I remain exceptionally pessimistic about Texas HSR given the current administration, even though I think it's a good idea. I wouldn't be surprised if Byford is shown the door in a couple of months for reasons of "government efficiency".

 

[George Harris]

First, IMHO, the Japanese know more about high-speed rail equipment, track, and operation than the various and sundry European and others that claim knowledge thereof will even begin to understand 10 years from now. So, I certainly hope that they stay with the Shinkansen equipment. Another not exactly incidental factor, due to the width of the Shinkansen cars, a platform built to give an ADA acceptable gap between platform and car floor will pass AAR standard width freight cars and equipment without need for any special games such as gantlet tracks. (The proper word is gantlet. A gauntlet is an armored glove. A gantlet is a tight passage, usually painful.)

why should passing freight cars even be an issue? Surely this is a dedicated passenger corridor and there are existing freight corridors that will continue to exist.

For starts, use of standard sized equipment for maintenance. That, at least, should be the obvious one.

 

[cirdan]

The Germans have more or less proven that mixed traffic on tracks capable of HSR doesn't scale capacity-wise.

There are plenty of mixed freight and HST lines. If they don't work as well as they should this is not a technical issue but a political and economic issue. For example freight through the channel tunnel and along the high speed line to London has lagged well below expectations for a variety of reasons, the principal of which have nothing to do with the technology.

However, I believe in north America this would be more problematic due to the heavier weight of freight cars, and the need to provide extra power to tackle the far steeper grades of HSR.

 

[cirdan]

For starts, use of standard sized equipment for maintenance. That, at least, should be the obvious one.

I would assume that if you buy off the shelf Japanese equipment, that you also maintain the infrastructure to their standards using their methods and that means you should buy their maintenance equipment. If you buy off the shelf German equipment, you likewise also buy the matching maintenance equipment. If you don't it's like trying to fix a German car with Japanese tools. There's always going to be something that doesn't fit.

It's a standalone system, it doesn't have to be compatible to anything else.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Dare I be optimistic and think that the current administration sees the real estate value of intercity passenger rail?

Here is a broad overview of his actual record...

Obviously conjecture. But with success of Brightline Florida + Brightline West underway, I'd be a little surprised if they tried to, say, pull back the Federal dollars they received for the BL West project. I really could see them pushing Brightline/any sort of private model (or at least a Amtrak-private partnership model) but we'll see.

According to Trump the main reason to defund Amtrak is because it's not profitable. Well, neither is Brightline Florida.

Given the challenges with CAHSR it’s right to be skeptical. I can see Amtrak’s interest in this particular market though for the reasons you mentioned. Also with the current politics you may have some of the powers that be a bit more sympathetic since it’s Texas.

As badly as the CAHSR project has gone it's a wild success story compared to TXHSR.

maybe Musk thinks a Hyperloop would be a better alternative? Good opportunity to put everything on hold while consultants make more money doing more feasability studies.

Supposedly the primary motivation for promoting Hyperloop and those claustrophobic car tunnels was to delay and derail public transit funding, especially passenger rail funding. And to be fair to Elon those projects did manage to waste a lot of time and money.

 

[Anthony V]

This project should be killed and the focus should instead be restoring passenger service to the UP tracks the Dallas-Houston leg of the Texas Eagle used until 1995. In addition to restoration of LD service in the corridor, there should be a multi-frequency, higher-speed, state-supported corridor running with a 110 mph top speed. Even this service pattern would be better than what we have now for service in the DAL-HOU travel market (e.g. only automobile-based options) Doing it this way would dramatically cut the costs of the project and eliminate eminent domain issues associated with building new ROW that have slowed down the project to a trickle.

 

[George Harris]

I would assume that if you buy off the shelf Japanese equipment, that you also maintain the infrastructure to their standards using their methods and that means you should buy their maintenance equipment. If you buy off the shelf German equipment, you likewise also buy the matching maintenance equipment. If you don't it's like trying to fix a German car with Japanese tools. There's always going to be something that doesn't fit.

It's a standalone system, it doesn't have to be compatible to anything else.

I am not going to try to deal with all you are saying other than to note you are starting out with "I would assume". For vehicles, you are probably mostly correct. For structures and track, no.

A point in favor of Shinkansen equipment is its much lower train weight per passenger. The additional width is a major reason for this in that the 3 & 2 seating coach is quite comfortable as is the 2 & 2 in the higher class seating. Also, these are EMU trainsets as opposed to the European power units plus coaches trainsets, so you are not running trains with two vehicles carrying zero passengers.

 

[Stevenz]

First, IMHO, the Japanese know more about high-speed rail equipment, track, and operation than the various and sundry European and others that claim knowledge thereof will even begin to understand 10 years from now.

Yes, the Japanese are the big dogs but the rest of the statement strikes me as a bit over-baked.

 

[cirdan]

A point in favor of Shinkansen equipment is its much lower train weight per passenger. The additional width is a major reason for this in that the 3 & 2 seating coach is quite comfortable as is the 2 & 2 in the higher class seating.

We have seen in China that the Germans had no difficulty providing a wide-bodied version of their own high speed train. This is not a major obstacle.

Dimensions of trains should be specified based on objective criteria rather than based on what somebody else did in a context and under conditions that are not directly transferable.

All the recent generations of ICE use distributed traction in the form of an EMU rather than locomotives. The early types of ICE used locomotives / power heads largely because the locomotives on which they were based had already been developed and were in production at the time and the design could be modified for higher speeds relatively easily while maintaining a significant pool of interchangeable parts. It was a purely pragmatic decision. It's not s if the Germans didn't know how to build an EMU (consider for example the class 403, built a decade or so previously, which was almost a high speed train).