Brightline Trains Florida discussion 2024

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Their planned seats per trainset is 8x 66 + 2x 50 seats, or 628 total seats per hour. Cutting more than 5% of their peak capacity isn't a great call.
Brightline have paid attention to an attractive and spacious interior. I'm sure they could easily add 5% more seats just by pinching an inch here and an inch there as indeed many airlines have done. Instead it seems they prefer to charge more for a more high-tier offering.
 
We got information from the VP Public Affairs of Brightline today following a question raised at the FCRP Annual Meeting that they will receive the first 5 new Coaches next month followed by 5 Coaches every two months to receive all 30 by this time next year. He did not say anything about Premium, but neither did we ask about it.
 
I’m planning a trip on Brightline for August. I will do a round trip from Miami to Orlando. Is there any way of determining which trains have the wraps that obscure the windows?
Good question. One way may be by monitoring their trains for a few days, possibly by some rail webcam, but that is still no guarantee, as things can change up to the last minute…
 
Do we really want trains to be more like airplanes? A good number of travelers complain about the way airlines have crammed people in like cattle to save a few inches.
 
Do we really want trains to be more like airplanes? A good number of travelers complain about the way airlines have crammed people in like cattle to save a few inches.
If it means corridor service stays affordable or becomes viable, yes. A mediocre train is better than driving myself.
 
Do we really want trains to be more like airplanes? A good number of travelers complain about the way airlines have crammed people in like cattle to save a few inches.
I don’t see Brightline messing with seat pitch to cram in a few more passengers per car, and I’ll also claim that train operations inherently benefit from longer seat pitch more than it costs. Since trains start and stop, churning passengers in and out, the longer pitch means that passengers can get in and out with less contortions even if you have an aisle seat. Brightline wants to keep their intermediate station stops fast (I think the PA script says “only a few moments” but ask me tomorrow afternoon), and wider pitch supports that. Additionally, the physics of trains makes them turn profitable on a cost-of-goods-sold basis way sooner than airplanes, because the train doesn’t have to burn two tons of fuel to leave the station. Steel wheels on steel rails are pretty amazing efficiency-wise, the only big improvement would be electrification.

For South Florida service, they’re competing with generally comfortable but slow and dangerous automobiles (someone spending $19 each way between Ft. Lauderdale and Miami probably doesn’t have to rock a rust bucket with broken a/c like my last car), and losing the comfort angle forfeits that. Similarly, on the Orlando service, they’re competing with cars that someone has to drive the whole way, and betting that they’ll sell enough potential drivers on a seat they can bill hours in (my usual justification), people that want a nicer experience than four hours in a car or TSA and domestic coach, and people that just want to try the train (in-law with my niece and nephew, who absolutely loved it).

Brightline seat pitch is 39” for both coach and first, more than AA narrowbody first or widebody premium economy, and both classes have 16 rows without accessibility accommodations. Going to 36” to fit 17 rows is still better than AA narrowbody premium economy, but now you’ve lost your seats being in lockstep with the windows, which means at least one row gets something even worse than an advertising wrap that blankets the windows.

The question for seat pitch changes is basically will the extra seats be sold enough to justify the costs of the change, including the costs of public perception, on trains that might only be full on a few segments daily? Would the more numerous seats make Brightline more competitive against a future sub-$10 Tri-Rail? Would Brightline benefit from pursuing that market? Would it alienate someone that wants the $100 to Orlando experience? Is it worth it when there are more passenger cars on a delivery schedule already?
 
We got information from the VP Public Affairs of Brightline today following a question raised at the FCRP Annual Meeting that they will receive the first 5 new Coaches next month followed by 5 Coaches every two months to receive all 30 by this time next year. He did not say anything about Premium, but neither did we ask about it.
This is the news that was needed. Seat pitch will not change for those more crowed trains IMO. So, is next month August and when in August?
 
Today’s ride is “Bright Orange,” with the Palm Beach wrap that doesn’t cover the windows. The announcement at intermediate stations described them as “quick two-minute stops.”
You appear to be including accessible seats in your counts.

Premium cars have 49 seats, not 50.

The baggage/coach cars have 58 seats.
There’s only one seat in the accessible row in first, but two named positions, 17 A and B. Presumably 17B is the space on the aisle side of the seat rail.
IMG_8378.jpeg
 
I’m planning a trip on Brightline for August. I will do a round trip from Miami to Orlando. Is there any way of determining which trains have the wraps that obscure the windows?
AFAIK there is only one window wrapped consist left. All the new wraps do not cover the windows after many of us complained.

Apparently this info is incorrect. Please ignore.
 
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I counted 3 trainsets with full wraps on the Cocoa railcam on 7/29: KIS, Bahamas, & ORL Health.
Then there are three full wrapped. I was told that no new wraps cover the windows. Clearly my information is incorrect so please ignore it.
 
Then there are three full wrapped. I was told that no new wraps cover the windows. Clearly my information is incorrect so please ignore it.
I believe these are all older wraps. There were 2 newer wraps on the line that did not cover the windows, except for a line or 2 on a few windows.

IIRC, the original Visit ORL wrap also obscured the windows. I don't whether it's been retired, or just wasn't out on the line yesterday.
 
Unless I am missing something, am I correct in that NO fares offer any kind of refunds other than credits? Doesn’t this seem kind of punitive? Amtrak offers refunds on most fares, at least partially, and so do airlines (albeit you pay more for this option in most cases). This seems really misguided; it’s not like you can use your Brightline credit somewhere out of state; visitors to Florida who need refunds would basically be out of luck.

This plus the fact that three trains remain fully wrapped discourages me from taking a round trip at the end of August.
 
Unless I am missing something, am I correct in that NO fares offer any kind of refunds other than credits? Doesn’t this seem kind of punitive? Amtrak offers refunds on most fares, at least partially, and so do airlines (albeit you pay more for this option in most cases). This seems really misguided; it’s not like you can use your Brightline credit somewhere out of state; visitors to Florida who need refunds would basically be out of luck.
Yep
And when you say fully wrapped, that means the wrap covers the windows, correct?
Yep again. Saw fully wrapped Kissimmee train on Friday.
 
Unless I am missing something, am I correct in that NO fares offer any kind of refunds other than credits? Doesn’t this seem kind of punitive? Amtrak offers refunds on most fares, at least partially, and so do airlines (albeit you pay more for this option in most cases). This seems really misguided; it’s not like you can use your Brightline credit somewhere out of state; visitors to Florida who need refunds would basically be out of luck.

This plus the fact that three trains remain fully wrapped discourages me from taking a round trip at the end of August.
Truth be told, personally for me, Brightline serves no transportation purpose for any of the trips I typically make, and I do go down to Miami from time to time. For me Brightline is only good for joyrides when I wish to take one. On an average my home to Miami, driving takes much less time than driving to Orlando and taking Brightline. But still it is a nice service provided one considers it as targeted to local travelers and not for tourists from far away coming on a single visit. The fare refund policy is not conducive to use by anyone who are not frequent repeat users of the service. As long as demand is greater than supply there is no reason for Brightline to become more infrequent traveler friendly.
 
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Truth be told, personally for me, Brightline serves no transportation purpose for any of the trips I typically make, and I do go down to Miami from time to time. For me Brightline is only good for joyrides when I wish to take one. On an average my home to Miami, driving takes much less time than driving to Orlando and taking Brightline. But still it is a nice service provided one considers it as targeted to local travelers and not for tourists from far away coming on a single visit. The fare refund policy is not conducive to use by anyone who are not frequent repeat users of the service. As long as demand is greater than supply there is no reason for Brightline to become more infrequent traveler friendly.
Same for me, even though I only live about a 30 minute drive west of their WPB station. If I am going to fly or cruise out of Miami, I will get a ride to WPB, and take Tri Rail, for a fraction of the fare. If I am going to Orlando, I could take Amtrak, and ride in much more comfortable equipment, and better food, although slower. If I’m in a hurry, I can drive there from my home in less time, and even paying for tolls and fuel, cost less. Especially if I take passengers with me.

That said, I will still want to try them, just for the novelty. Perhaps wait until they extend to Tampa or Jacksonville.🙂
 
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