Empire Builder Summer Blues Started Early this year

[Bob Dylan]

From 8: Passengers connecting to 30 will apparently make it, by 10 minutes.

Enjoy your evening in Chicago Charlie! :hi: I'm one of those that has made the Platform Dash in Union Station from #6/#8/#4/#22 etc. to make a Connection East or to NOL! The Amtrak Staff in CHI is Very Experienced when it comes to Juggling Trains/Busses/Hotels etc. since they get So Much Practice! Think I'll skip the EB for awhile till the Oil Boom Mellows out and the Trackwork, the Heat Slow orders and Flooding goes away on the High Line!

 

[CHamilton]

As predicted, train 8 pulled into CHI at 5:50, and the folks connecting to 30 were told to go directly from our track (19) to track 26. So with any luck, they should have made it.

Glad I didn't have to make a connection tonight. Am safely arrived at my hotel, and not even wet, although a huge thunderstorm erupted while in the taxi halfway here, and I met a British couple in the elevator who were thoroughly soaked.

Off to find something to eat, then I'll relax tonight and resume the trip east tomorrow.

 

[D.P. Roberts]

From 8: Announced that all connecting passengers will be bussed from Chicago except 354 will be bussed from MKE, 305 passengers will take 307, and no information on 30 yet. ETA into Chicago 6 pm, as we will get stuck behind Metra.

If 8 is late, do they ever bus people who are trying to connect to 30? I don't see how it would help, but I know Amtrak has bussed people in stranger situations.

 

[tonys96]

This information is really helpfu.!

We will be going from PDX to MSP on the EB in August. I see the late arrivals to CHI, but how has the OTP been to MSP? How late has it ran to there?

Thanks

 

[Guest]

When a situation like this happens, how do they determine to put connecting passengers on a bus vs. putting them up overnight?

 

[Ryan]

Timing. If it's close enough that a bus can make the connection, they'll do it. If there's no chance, a hotel is the answer.

 

[Ryan]

This information is really helpfu.!
We will be going from PDX to MSP on the EB in August. I see the late arrivals to CHI, but how has the OTP been to MSP? How late has it ran to there?

Thanks

http://www.dixielandsoftware.net/Amtrak/status/StatusPages/EmpireBuilderStatus.htmhttp://www.amtrakdelays.onlineschedulingsoftware.com/cgi-bin/train.cgi

 

[Choo Choo]

Timing. If it's close enough that a bus can make the connection, they'll do it. If there's no chance, a hotel is the answer.

With the current average on time performance for #8, what would the most likely course of action be for #50 connecting passengers that are only going to central WV? Bus to Indianapolis, next day #30 in coach and connect to #51 back, or bus all the way from CHI? I know of atleast 4 first class (not that it matters) passengers that will be making this connection.

 

[yarrow]

Timing. If it's close enough that a bus can make the connection, they'll do it. If there's no chance, a hotel is the answer.

or something else. a couple years ago we got to chi on the eb at 6:30 am(instead of 3:55 pm the previous day). we were headed to was. were told by conductors and an amtrak person who got on in msp that we would be put up and fed in chi and be on that evening's cl. when we got to chi, we were told we would be on an 18 hr bus trip to was and the busses were outside and "all aboard"

 

[Observer]

Do they usually bus people to Detroit? Seems like I may miss a connection if the EB has been coming in as late as it is.

 

[June the Coach Rider]

I have seen kind of a pattern in the ontime performance of Train 8 on the weekends into Chicago. It seems that weekend arrivals tend to do better on time. I'll be on Train 8 (2) next month (July) from MT (arrival in CHI July 4th) and was wondering if any of you think that whatever forces at work on the weekends that help Train 8 might also play a role in keeping better time due to the July 4th holiday? It'll put a huge kink in things to miss the Train 50 connection to central WV. Amtraks voucher will be usless to all members of my party since the last I traveled was 4 years ago and the other reservation couple was 5 years ago.

I will be in Chicago on July 4th, but arriving on the LSL and leaving on the SWC. Should see fireworks on the SWC that night and maybe the night before on the LSL

 

[tonys96]

This information is really helpfu.!
We will be going from PDX to MSP on the EB in August. I see the late arrivals to CHI, but how has the OTP been to MSP? How late has it ran to there?

Thanks

http://www.dixielandsoftware.net/Amtrak/status/StatusPages/EmpireBuilderStatus.htmhttp://www.amtrakdelays.onlineschedulingsoftware.com/cgi-bin/train.cgi

Thanks!

The first link shows about 1.5 to 2 hrs late which will be no problem at all.

The second link did not work on my laptop

 

[montana mike]

I see this AM, after a couple of days where #8 was "only 90+ minutes late into CHI, yesterday #8 was over 3 hours behind schedule and today's #8, currently still in MN, not even to MSP yet, is over 4 hours behind--good grief. #7 in ND isn't doing much better either. This is going to be a long summer for the EB. Were the last two day's delays due to any one time things or just more of the same ongoing contributors?

 

[yarrow]

I see this AM, after a couple of days where #8 was "only 90+ minutes late into CHI, yesterday #8 was over 3 hours behind schedule and today's #8, currently still in MN, not even to MSP yet, is over 4 hours behind--good grief. #7 in ND isn't doing much better either. This is going to be a long summer for the EB. Were the last two day's delays due to any one time things or just more of the same ongoing contributors?

i seem to remember last year that the trains that went through n.dakota on the weekends seemed generally to do better and i assumed this was because of less trackwork. that doesn't necessarily apply in this case but, iirc, the weekend trains did better than the trains during last week

 

[JayPea]

#7 of yesterday wasn't doing too badly until the usual trouble spots in N.D. It left Chicago half an hour down, and was over an hour down til Minneapolis, when it left only 30 minutes down. I'm tracking it closely as I board #27 to Portland tomorrow morning in Spokane. I've noticed other EB's that are this late (2hrs 15 minutes at Rugby) eventually make up enough time that they are less than an hour late into Portland. Here's hoping that still holds true.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Jeff: D-Day but who's Counting, Right? ^_^ It doesnt look real Good! #7 is over 2 Hours Late out of Minot and as we say. Late Trains tend to become Very Late! I know you're used to being in the SPK Station in the Wee Hours, I'm not sure what time it gets Light in that part of the World Now but I'd think that you may even be having Breakfast soon after Rolling out of SPK or even in SPK! Tough Summer on the High Line and it doesn't look like things will Improve till Fall! Hope the Ride down the Columbia is Smooth, the Sun is Shinning and your Marginals beat the Flubs! Bet you wont be Sleeping much today/tonight!

 

[tomfuller]

27 will be arriving in PDX by 10AM PDT about 10 minutes early.

The joined train arrived in Spokane about 3 minutes late.

 

[JayPea]

Sleep???Heck no! I was up at quarter to three this AM, checking the Amtrak status maps first thing! :lol: And I'm not going to take a nap later! I don't want to take a chance on oversleeping and missing the train! :lol: As for light, about 4-4:30 it begins to lighten up, particularly if the idiots who misforecast our weather here are actually right, as it's supposed to be clear tomorrow morning. I'll keep checking the status maps. This is Amtrak we're talking about so plenty can happen in the next few hours but as I said before if the same pattern holds, I should get into Portland an hour to hour and a half late, plenty of time to peruse Powell's Bookstore and grab lunch at Jake's Famous Crawfish. I hope! I catch Cascades 516 to Seattle at 2:45 tomorrow afternoon (I think; they've changed the departure time so many times) but hopefully have plenty of time to do what I wanted to do in Portland first.

 

[montana mike]

Looking like #8, now still plugging away across MN will be over 4 hours late in CHI town. Bummer, many connections to miss when they are that late, unless Amtrak holds some of the trains.

:-(

PS-My son was on #7 yesterday and arrived in WFH only 50 minutes behind schedule, which we thought was quite good. He said they lost about an hour for slow orders in Eastern MT and perhaps as much for the same in ND, but were able to make up more than half of those delays by the time the train arrived in WFH. All in all not too bad a performance given some of the other delays we have seen in WFH over the past couple weeks.

 

[D.P. Roberts]

Looking like #8, now still plugging away across MN will be over 4 hours late in CHI town. Bummer, many connections to miss when they are that late, unless Amtrak holds some of the trains.:-(

PS-My son was on #7 yesterday and arrived in WFH only 50 minutes behind schedule, which we thought was quite good. He said they lost about an hour for slow orders in Eastern MT and perhaps as much for the same in ND, but were able to make up more than half of those delays by the time the train arrived in WFH. All in all not too bad a performance given some of the other delays we have seen in WFH over the past couple weeks.

Yeah, 52 minutes late into WFH isn't bad for this week - #7 is currently running 2 hours 42 minutes crossing into Montana right now. At this rate will probably arrive in WFH around midnight.

With 8 running 4 hours late in Minnesota right now, it looks like it will miss the connection to 30 again. Sixth time in eight days.

 

[gmushial]

Looking like #8, now still plugging away across MN will be over 4 hours late in CHI town. Bummer, many connections to miss when they are that late, unless Amtrak holds some of the trains.:-(

PS-My son was on #7 yesterday and arrived in WFH only 50 minutes behind schedule, which we thought was quite good. He said they lost about an hour for slow orders in Eastern MT and perhaps as much for the same in ND, but were able to make up more than half of those delays by the time the train arrived in WFH. All in all not too bad a performance given some of the other delays we have seen in WFH over the past couple weeks.

I know when I was on #6 in May we picked up about an hour btwn DEN and LNK - my question is: how much room is there to make up time? Clearly the way one makes up time is by going faster... just how much faster can an engineer get away with? If a section can nominally be traversed at 60, can he do 65, 70? When does he get into trouble, either with superiors or reality, ie, train hops track etc?

 

[jebr]

Looking like #8, now still plugging away across MN will be over 4 hours late in CHI town. Bummer, many connections to miss when they are that late, unless Amtrak holds some of the trains.:-(

PS-My son was on #7 yesterday and arrived in WFH only 50 minutes behind schedule, which we thought was quite good. He said they lost about an hour for slow orders in Eastern MT and perhaps as much for the same in ND, but were able to make up more than half of those delays by the time the train arrived in WFH. All in all not too bad a performance given some of the other delays we have seen in WFH over the past couple weeks.

I know when I was on #6 in May we picked up about an hour btwn DEN and LNK - my question is: how much room is there to make up time? Clearly the way one makes up time is by going faster... just how much faster can an engineer get away with? If a section can nominally be traversed at 60, can he do 65, 70? When does he get into trouble, either with superiors or reality, ie, train hops track etc?

0MPH over speed limit. If a track is rated for 79MPH, he can get in trouble for doing 80MPH. I don't know how much leeway they give, but it's 1-2MPH at most.

 

[gmushial]

Looking like #8, now still plugging away across MN will be over 4 hours late in CHI town. Bummer, many connections to miss when they are that late, unless Amtrak holds some of the trains.:-(

PS-My son was on #7 yesterday and arrived in WFH only 50 minutes behind schedule, which we thought was quite good. He said they lost about an hour for slow orders in Eastern MT and perhaps as much for the same in ND, but were able to make up more than half of those delays by the time the train arrived in WFH. All in all not too bad a performance given some of the other delays we have seen in WFH over the past couple weeks.

I know when I was on #6 in May we picked up about an hour btwn DEN and LNK - my question is: how much room is there to make up time? Clearly the way one makes up time is by going faster... just how much faster can an engineer get away with? If a section can nominally be traversed at 60, can he do 65, 70? When does he get into trouble, either with superiors or reality, ie, train hops track etc?

0MPH over speed limit. If a track is rated for 79MPH, he can get in trouble for doing 80MPH. I don't know how much leeway they give, but it's 1-2MPH at most.

Thank you for the reply. Is there a difference btwn the track speed limit, and normal traversal speed, ie, as a margin of safety does a train or schedule have trains travel somewhat below the speed limit? ... so when we picked up the hour btwn DEN and LNK, he was probably pushing right up against the limit, whereas the normal speed might have been somewhat slower? Likewise, I'm assuming GPS is used to report train locations back to OMA or wherever - is that how it would be found out he was over the limit?

 

[Texan Eagle]

Thank you for the reply. Is there a difference btwn the track speed limit, and normal traversal speed, ie, as a margin of safety does a train or schedule have trains travel somewhat below the speed limit? ... so when we picked up the hour btwn DEN and LNK, he was probably pushing right up against the limit, whereas the normal speed might have been somewhat slower? Likewise, I'm assuming GPS is used to report train locations back to OMA or wherever - is that how it would be found out he was over the limit?

If track is rated for 79MPH, engineer will go at 79MPH all the time unless there are slow orders or signals slowing them down. The way long distance trains "make up time" is due to padding. Their schedules are laid out liberally. If traveling from station A to B actually takes 3hrs if done at 79MPH all the way, the time allocated for this run would be, say, 3.5hrs. So now if you got a clear track, you have "made up" 30 minutes of schedule without doing anything extraordinary.

As for reporting, I believe the locomotives have a tracking device that registers what speed the engineer was doing and the data is collected at end of trip (or relayed in real time? not sure) for analysis. If I remember correctly, the locomotives also have a speed control mechanism where brakes are applied automatically if the engineer overspeeds over a certain threshold.

 

[JayPea]

Not looking great now for me as the EB is now over 3 hrs late out of Wolf Point and always loses time between Wolf Point and Glasgow. But past Havre I've noticed the tendency is to make up time and lots of it. Powell's and Jake's may be out, though.