St. Paul, Milwaukee, Chicago Corridor service H2 2024

[WWW]

Two Borealis items:

1. 100,000th passenger served on the Borealis 22 weeks after launch
https://www.jsonline.com/story/news...e-twin-cities-hits-100000-riders/75838498007/
https://www.progressiverailroading....ns-served-over-100000-riders-since-May--73161

2. September showed promising improvement in on-time performance
September
84.1% of all station stops were on time
75.5% of all customers arrived at their station on-time

May through August
62.2% of all station stops were on time
45.2% of all customers arrived at their station on-time

CPKC permitting Borealis to start before "required" improvments are in place does risk higher delays, but big picture I don't think it was a mistake to not wait for a couple more years for them to be done.

It feels like...and this could be a wrong imprssion...that unless the westbound is almost perfectly on time at Red Wing that it often takes a very ugly delay between there at St Paul. I seem to recall the reuiqrement improvements were mostly around La Crosse / Winona and also St Paul. Anybody know more about delays on that last segment RDW-STP and if improvements are underway?

Links to the stat sources:

September OT (page 12 Current Month stat)
https://www.amtrak.com/content/dam/...eptember-2024-Amtrak-Host-Railroad-Report.pdf

May through August (page 12, the Most Recent 12 Months stat)
https://www.amtrak.com/content/dam/...s/August-2024-Amtrak-Host-Railroad-Report.pdf

Once crossing the river at Hastings - there are two routes - the KCP river route thru St. Paul Park and the
BNSF (hi-line) thru Cottage Grove - both of these merge at Newport - this is sometimes a chock point - then
further towards St. Paul at The Pigs Eye freight yard of KCP the tracks diverge into 4 tracks leading into the
Division Street Wye just east of SPUD (St Paul Union Depot) - this also presents a MAJOR problem for ease
of access to SPUD - 2 of these 4 tracks follow the river and 2 hug the bluff and these split off north of the
Wye - one to the BNSF Midway Division and the other the UP to points east in Wisconsin (Eau Claire) - there are some 60 plus trains daily transiting the Wye some simple short way-freights and others 100 or more cars
of various commodities. The 2 river tracks KCP and UP do not connect to the SPUD tracks - of the other 2
ONLY the inside track goes to SPUD the other does not.
Threading the needle here is the final piece de la resistance in delaying Amtrak Borealis from schedule !
No matter how timely the progress has been made up to and passed Pigs Eye - - -
WAIT FOR IT !
CLEARANCE TO TRANSIST THE WYE TO SPUD !

Google Map image detail zooom in/out for more definition:

https://www.google.com/maps/@44.950...try=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI0MTAyMy4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw==

Exasperating to come this far timely and snatch delay from the jaws of timeliness - - -
Crews and Agents catching heat from this - not their problem - - -
Certainly a slot for a 5 car 2 engine train should be made available with priority - - -
Safety issues concerns not withstanding

 

[OmahaRoad]

To expand on what WW said, MnDOT staff confirmed this rail congestion near SPUD is the issue. He claimed that the freight dispatchers have a "really hard time" getting trains through that area, since, as WWW said, there are over 60 a day. If the Borealis is "out of slot," then yes, it gets stuck waiting for freight traffic to clear.

I take issue with this explanation because there's been plenty of times where the Borealis is either on time or under five minutes late at Red Wing where it *still* ends up being 10-20 minutes late at SPUD. Very unfair to Borealis passengers!

 

[Metra Electric Rider]

Fluffy news piece, but positive:

 

[NewRails]

Barring any personal or weather-related things that come up, I'm booked for my first-ever Borealis trip as the last leg of my Thanksgiving Amtrak odyssey home to Minnesota from North Carolina! Will just be in coach, which will be a step down from the Floridian roomette that my girlfriend and I will be in all the way from Raleigh to Chicago. Couldn't justify the price for business class though the privacy and larger seats would be nice.

Honestly, though, I am more interested in experiencing coach class anyway, so I can compare my experiences to those of others on this new service, and be able to understand others' opinions on the seats/space better. I've heard so much criticism of the old Horizon cars over the past 2-3 years that I am honestly intrigued to finally experience them myself (Criticism includes a YouTuber visiting from another nation who took the Cascades and called the Horizons "prison cars" and whatnot)

I can't wait to try out the Borealis! Getting into MSP so much earlier than the Builder will be excellent, and also much more convenient for my family to pick us up. Even if the Borealis is 30-45 minutes late, which 1333 has been on and off, 7 to 7:15 is a world better than 4-ish hours later.

Welcome aboard! Borealis bookings are rapidly filling up for next month.
Check out WisARP's website wisarp.wordpress.com for more information on this successful Amtrak passenger rail expansion.

 

[Agent]

Fluffy news piece, but positive:

I liked the close-up of the locomotive at the 30 second mark. Just ever so slightly different-looking than that how the engines appeared in front of the cameras during the inaugural runs.

 

[OmahaRoad]

Welcome aboard! Borealis bookings are rapidly filling up for next month.
Check out WisARP's website wisarp.wordpress.com for more information on this successful Amtrak passenger rail expansion.

I am glad I got booked ahead of schedule because prices were already high (understandable, given that I'm traveling the week of Thanksgiving!) on the Borealis back when I bought our tickets.

Can't wait to ride the Borealis for the first time less than a month from now!

 

[Metra Electric Rider]

I liked the close-up of the locomotive at the 30 second mark. Just ever so slightly different-looking than that how the engines appeared in front of the cameras during the inaugural runs.

Yes, yeah, I was thinking of mentioning that...

 

[Steve Manfred]

KARE11 in the Twin Cities ran this feature on the Borealis last night (Nov. 13, 2024):
https://www.kare11.com/article/news...icago/89-42072276-19b1-4acc-8dd0-cfbe3bb44020

 

[TheVig]

KARE11 in the Twin Cities ran this feature on the Borealis last night (Nov. 13, 2024):
https://www.kare11.com/article/news...icago/89-42072276-19b1-4acc-8dd0-cfbe3bb44020

“If we could add more cars, we would,” Magliari said.

 

[railiner]

“If we could add more cars, we would,” Magliari said.

If there's such a shortage of cars, perhaps Amtrak should purchase or maybe lease some surplus commuter cars from Metra, and run them on some Chicago - Milwaukee trains...it's only 85 miles, and those cars should be comfortable enough for such a short hop...

 

[WWW]

If there's such a shortage of cars, perhaps Amtrak should purchase or maybe lease some surplus commuter cars from Metra, and run them on some Chicago - Milwaukee trains...it's only 85 miles, and those cars should be comfortable enough for such a short hop...

A problem with this is the Push+Pull configuration of the Borealis -
splitting the train apart is not a solution
Amtrak could go to its bone yard at Beech Grove and perhaps roust out a couple sets (2) of cars that would
may be compatible with the existing configuration
Not a terrific solution but Amtrak could take a few cars off of the Hiawatha replacing with Metra equipment
As previously posted elsewhere adding an additional business semi-combo business car would help
Even dining cars with a full compliment of tables would help - - -

This additional rail service is developing more rapidly than expected - Amtrak - "This is a wake up call " !

 

[OmahaRoad]

“If we could add more cars, we would,” Magliari said.

Although I did share in your mirthful reaction to this, he did say after this that they are working on adding more cars. Of course, not a one of us will hold our breaths, but given the Borealis's success + the probable desire of Amtrak to hold it up as an example of a "new corridor service that works," I think the odds we'll see a 5th coach in 2025 are at least 50/50, if not 60/40. Will be interested to see how accurate my prediction is!

 

[railiner]

A problem with this is the Push+Pull configuration of the Borealis -
splitting the train apart is not a solution
Amtrak could go to its bone yard at Beech Grove and perhaps roust out a couple sets (2) of cars that would
may be compatible with the existing configuration
Not a terrific solution but Amtrak could take a few cars off of the Hiawatha replacing with Metra equipment
As previously posted elsewhere adding an additional business semi-combo business car would help
Even dining cars with a full compliment of tables would help - - -

This additional rail service is developing more rapidly than expected - Amtrak - "This is a wake up call " !

I wasn’t meaning to add the commuter cars to the Borealis, or any of the Horizon sets; but rather, replace a couple of entire Chicago - Milwaukee trains with all commuter cars, to free up the Horizons for the Borealis.
But done either way, it could help…

 

[Metra Electric Rider]

I wasn’t meaning to add the commuter cars to the Borealis, or any of the Horizon sets; but rather, replace a couple of entire Chicago - Milwaukee trains with all commuter cars, to free up the Horizons for the Borealis.
But done either way, it could help…

Or just get Metra to run to Milwaukee. They are going to be handling the Rockford service in the future (of course, one would have to get some buy in from various counties in Wisconsin .

 

[railiner]

Or just get Metra to run to Milwaukee. They are going to be handling the Rockford service in the future (of course, one would have to get some buy in from various counties in Wisconsin .

Or let Metra run to Milwaukee via Kenosha, and Amtrak as present?

Prior to Amtrak, there was enough traffic to support MILW and C&NW service on both routes.

And even more counting the North Shore interurban…

 

[NorthShore]

Or let Metra run to Milwaukee via Kenosha, and Amtrak as present?

Prior to Amtrak, there was enough traffic to support MILW and C&NW service on both routes.

And even more counting the North Shore interurban…

Somebody mention my name?

 

[toddinde]

Or just get Metra to run to Milwaukee. They are going to be handling the Rockford service in the future (of course, one would have to get some buy in from various counties in Wisconsin .

There isn’t a reason Amtrak would give up one of its most successful routes. I don’t think the Metra suburban cars provide the level of comfort that Amtrak provides and that would be acceptable to Chicago-Milwaukee passengers. Perhaps when they get the KRM line running.

 

[TransitTyrant]

Or just get Metra to run to Milwaukee. They are going to be handling the Rockford service in the future (of course, one would have to get some buy in from various counties in Wisconsin .

That doesn’t solve any issues because WisDOT wants more than just more Chicago-Milwaukee service, they want to extend those trains to other parts of the state like Green Bay, Madison, and Eau Claire.

 

[railiner]

There isn’t a reason Amtrak would give up one of its most successful routes. I don’t think the Metra suburban cars provide the level of comfort that Amtrak provides and that would be acceptable to Chicago-Milwaukee passengers. Perhaps when they get the KRM line running.

Not Amtrak give up, but have Metra run there too, as an extension of their Kenosha service.
It would offer a lower cost alternative, similar to NJT/SEPTA between New York and Philly.

As for comfort, I don’t think the Gallery car seats are much worse than those Venture’s

 

[Mr.Technician]

Fluffy news piece, but positive:

I'm seeing this late, but I was the one interviewed. The thumbnail is myself, my brother, and our friend boarding.

 

[Metra Electric Rider]

We've got a

I'm seeing this late, but I was the one interviewed. The thumbnail is myself, my brother, and our friend boarding.

Oooo, we've got a YouTube celebrity in our midst!

 

[Septa9739]

Not Amtrak give up, but have Metra run there too, as an extension of their Kenosha service.
It would offer a lower cost alternative, similar to NJT/SEPTA between New York and Philly.

Funnily enough, after the new Amtrak fare cuts and the NJT and soon to be SEPTA hikes, Amtrak offers a cheaper ride when you buy in advance.

 

[Mr.Technician]

Oooo, we've got a YouTube celebrity in our midst!

If only I'd given RailForLess a shoutout!

 

[Stevenz]

Extending Metra to Milwaukee has been studied several times, most recently in the 2000’s, which I participated in. There are a number of problems. One of them is that it isn’t a practical Milwaukee to Chicago option. Metra has many many stops and a Milwaukee extension would add more. Already Kenosha to downtown Chicago is excruciatingly slow, like 2.5 hours if I remember right, so the actual MKE-CHI market is small.

 

[ryanwc]

Extending Metra to Milwaukee has been studied several times, most recently in the 2000’s, which I participated in. There are a number of problems. One of them is that it isn’t a practical Milwaukee to Chicago option. Metra has many many stops and a Milwaukee extension would add more. Already Kenosha to downtown Chicago is excruciatingly slow, like 2.5 hours if I remember right, so the actual MKE-CHI market is small.

Most are an hour and a half. A couple are ten minutes longer and for some reason, one takes 2:08. None are 2.5 hours. I imagine there are more Kenosha boardings to Lake Forest, Highland Park and Evanston than to downtown.