Via Rail vis-a-vis Amtrak

[LA Resident]

Has anyone taken the Canadian, the premiere train of the Via Rail system, between Vancouver and Toronto in the last year?

Is it worth the cost (at least double the Empire Builder or Zephyr for similar bedroom-type accommodations) for the experience, said to include spectacular scenery and four-star meals at every sitting? Are three full days too much (though not sure there is ever enough time for a train ride if the train is spectacular)?

In other words, if someone has taken the Empire Builder once, the Zephyr three times, the SWC a half-dozen, the Sunset twice, the CS seven, is it time for a Via Rail ride?

Thoughts?

 

[NorthCoastHiawatha]

I took the Canadian in 2007 (have a trip booked for March of this year) and I definitely recommend it. It is the last remnant of the golden age, the only place in North America where you can still ride in an open section. It has dome cars and a spectacular dining car and by the end of 3 days I still wanted more. It is worth the cost by far.

 

[Steve4031]

Best train ride by far. Enjoy the dome cars

 

[chandj]

I can't say if it was worth the price as my mother in law paid--but it was fantastic. I could have stayed on much longer.

 

[njdon]

Along these same lines is better to go east to west or west to east?

 

[rrdude]

Has anyone taken the Canadian, the premiere train of the Via Rail system, between Vancouver and Toronto in the last year?

Is it worth the cost (at least double the Empire Builder or Zephyr for similar bedroom-type accommodations) for the experience, said to include spectacular scenery and four-star meals at every sitting? Are three full days too much (though not sure there is ever enough time for a train ride if the train is spectacular)?

In other words, if someone has taken the Empire Builder once, the Zephyr three times, the SWC a half-dozen, the Sunset twice, the CS seven, is it time for a Via Rail ride?

Thoughts?

I think The Ocean (Montreal-Gaspe/Halifax) still has open sections, well, when they run it with the Budd-Built sleepers that is. I rode it last April.

As for "is it worth the difference in price..............." O my gosh yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes!

"Do it while you still can", it's like riding in a well-kept museum piece. But what enamored me so profoundly was not only the fabulous condition of these "Heritage-Style" cars, but the attitude of the crew and on-board employees, heck even the station employees!

I bet Amtrak's complaints would be cut by 2/3 to 4/5, (even if they had the same equipment issues) if every Amtrak employee was trained, and behaved as the LD Via-Rail crews I've been exposed to. Don't get me wrong, there are great Amtrak employees, but they seem to be the exception, not the norm.

 

[Tracktwentynine]

I rode Via most of the way across Canada back in 2008. I started in Halifax and went as far as Edmonton on Via. That included riding the Canadian from Toronto to Edmonton. I completed my transcontinental journey by driving a rental car from Edmonton to Banff and then riding the Rocky Mountaineer to Vancouver.

The Canadian is something everyone who enjoys rail travel should do before they die. The food is one of the best attributes of the trip. Every meal is like eating in the best restaurant in whatever province you're traveling through at the moment. The domes give you a perspective you just can't get very much any more. Amtrak does have one dome left in its fleet, but few - if any - other mainline railroads use them these days. And of course, the Canadian Rockies are probably one of the most scenic places on Earth, and at a minimum in North America.

The Canadian is the last vestige of the Golden Age of railroading on this continent. And if you don't ride it while you still can, you'll probably regret it. It's worth every penny, as far as I'm concerned. I would do it again in a heartbeat. Unfortunately, I have to save up those pennies first.

I have ridden the Builder and the Starlight. So far, the other western LD routes have escaped me.

 

[Bob Dylan]

:hi: Nice trip! I totally agree about VIA and the Canadian! :wub: Get it while you can! Be sure and ride the Cali Zephyr, the scenery is the closest thing we have to the Canadian Rockies even if the train and crew arent up to VIA standards! This is one train that really needs Amtrak enancement similar to the EB and the CS!

 

[hello]

This is still at the top of my bucket list!!

 

Hopefully next year we'll try to plan it -- still confused as to the best direction. We will probably be going in late April or early May, and would like to catch Amtrak one way, and VIA the other.

 

[boxcar479]

Where I come from, if you have to ask yourself. Am I? Should I? Do I need to? You probably are, You probably should, and yes, you probably need to! This will surely keep you from saying I wish I would've. Or what if, later on in life. As far as which direction to go A wise man once said follow the sun, east to west. Makes sense to me. Yep get off the debating society, and get on that train. That's what I would do!

 

[henryj]

Has anyone taken the Canadian, the premiere train of the Via Rail system, between Vancouver and Toronto in the last year?

Is it worth the cost (at least double the Empire Builder or Zephyr for similar bedroom-type accommodations) for the experience, said to include spectacular scenery and four-star meals at every sitting? Are three full days too much (though not sure there is ever enough time for a train ride if the train is spectacular)?

In other words, if someone has taken the Empire Builder once, the Zephyr three times, the SWC a half-dozen, the Sunset twice, the CS seven, is it time for a Via Rail ride?

Thoughts?

I took this trip from Toronto to Vancouver in 2008. This train is a level above anything Amtrak can muster for pure old time luxury and service. It's truly a trip on one of the great trains of the past. All meals are included and they are expertly done and served. Champagne is served in the lounge car on occasion. Three full days and four nights are by no means too much. The train stops in Jasper and Winnipeg for several hours so you can get off and stretch your legs. It also makes several extended service stops where you can get off for a spell. If you think you don't want to be on the train that long then plan a stop over in Jasper for a day or two for some relaxation in the mountains. Westbound you start off crossing the endless plains of Manitoba, Saskatchewan and eastern Alberta so the scenery builds as does the anticipation of seeing the first sight of the Rockies. Eastbound you get the best first but every mile of the route is interesting and the on board staff does a good job of pointing out the highlights. The CN route goes through some of the most remote country you will ever see on the eastern end. If you like riding trains this is a trip not to be missed. Finally, if you watch the dates you can travel at reduced rates before Memorial Day or after Labor Day.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

This is still at the top of my bucket list!!

 

Hopefully next year we'll try to plan it -- still confused as to the best direction. We will probably be going in late April or early May, and would like to catch Amtrak one way, and VIA the other.

Either direction is ok on the Canadian or the EB. The most important Amtrak LD that matters about direction is the CZ. It needs by all means to be a westbound trip. Because, eastbound, if the train is late you might see the best of the Rockies in the dark. But I do not think the CZ is what you mean.

 

[hello]

No, we just haven't decided if we want to take VIA from Vancouver (to Toronto), and then VIA/Amtrak back to the West Coast; or take Amtrak to the East Coast, and catch VIA in Toronto (to Vancouver).

 

Great news about the scenery westbound on the CZ, we will be on the westbound in May!

 

[guest]

Great thread.

I have looked at the VIA website and found it a bit difficult to get answers to some basic questions. Maybe I gave up too easily, but does nay one know simple answers to the following:

Are there different price ranges for different sleeping accommodations, i.e. roomettes versus full bedrooms? How about some kind of "dorm car" with bunks but not private rooms - a place to at least sleep more comfortably than in coach?

How comfortable is coach for a three day trip? Are coach fares also a lot higher than Amtrak?

The point was made that it less expensive off season.

Is there a rail pass available?

Is there a difficult "bucket pricing" system as on Amtrak?

Can you book a LD trip and make some one or two day layover stops without booking separate tickets? Is there a senior discount?

Answers to these and any other implied questions greatly appreciated.

 

[rrdude]

Great thread.

I have looked at the VIA website and found it a bit difficult to get answers to some basic questions. Maybe I gave up too easily, but does nay one know simple answers to the following:

Are there different price ranges for different sleeping accommodations, i.e. roomettes versus full bedrooms? ABSOLUTELY. Depending upon the train/season, some sleepers INCLUDE meals, others DON'T. but it tells you online, when choosing the selections. How about some kind of "dorm car" with bunks but not private rooms - a place to at least sleep more comfortably than in coach? That would be the "berths" often called "sectionals" , they are chairs by day, and beds by night (top/bottom) they have only a curtain for privacy.

How comfortable is coach for a three day trip? Generally, if you are younger, coach is tolerable. After I reached my mid-twenties, I gave up coach overnight. IMHO there is NOTHING like having a FLAT BED (And Via Rail's beds are more comfortable than Amtrak) Are coach fares also a lot higher than Amtrak? Generally yes, but they often have "deals" too.

The point was made that it less expensive off season. Substantially less in off-season.

Is there a rail pass available? Yes, some more info here.

Is there a difficult "bucket pricing" system as on Amtrak? I wouldn't call it difficult, but they do use a form of yield management.

Can you book a LD trip and make some one or two day layover stops without booking separate tickets? Is there a senior discount? Yes, and Yes.

Answers to these and any other implied questions greatly appreciated.Spend some time on the VIA Rail website, that's where I got my answers to your questions......

 

[henryj]

Go to the Via web site and choose Trains, then Toronto to Vancouver. It then tells you the accomodations available and all kinds of other information under Classes, Train Cars, Schedules, Useful Information, Cities in Route, etc. Pick a date and direction and it will give you the options and fares. Remember, this train is often sold out well in advance, so it you don't see all the options available then pick a different date. Also it only runs three times a week so pick the right dates. I would not recommend coach(economy class) for this long of a trip. Remember that sleeper touring class includes all meals, not an insignificant thing on a three day trip. The train usually includes two coaches mostly for local passengers and a dome lounge coffee shop car(skyline car) for coach passengers. Economy class is not allowed into the first class section I don't believe and there is no shower. The fare shopping tool for May 3rd for instance, shows a one way economy fare of $525, an upper berth as $962, a roomette at $1451 and a bedroom for two at $2177 for a Vancouver to Toronto booking(Canadian Dollars). I looked up a March date and some accomodations are already sold out.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Great thread.

I have looked at the VIA website and found it a bit difficult to get answers to some basic questions. Maybe I gave up too easily, but does nay one know simple answers to the following:

Are there different price ranges for different sleeping accommodations, i.e. roomettes versus full bedrooms? ABSOLUTELY. Depending upon the train/season, some sleepers INCLUDE meals, others DON'T. but it tells you online, when choosing the selections. How about some kind of "dorm car" with bunks but not private rooms - a place to at least sleep more comfortably than in coach? That would be the "berths" often called "sectionals" , they are chairs by day, and beds by night (top/bottom) they have only a curtain for privacy.

How comfortable is coach for a three day trip? Generally, if you are younger, coach is tolerable. After I reached my mid-twenties, I gave up coach overnight. IMHO there is NOTHING like having a FLAT BED (And Via Rail's beds are more comfortable than Amtrak) Are coach fares also a lot higher than Amtrak? Generally yes, but they often have "deals" too.

The point was made that it less expensive off season. Substantially less in off-season.

Is there a rail pass available? Yes, some more info here.

Is there a difficult "bucket pricing" system as on Amtrak? I wouldn't call it difficult, but they do use a form of yield management.

Can you book a LD trip and make some one or two day layover stops without booking separate tickets? Is there a senior discount? Yes, and Yes.

Answers to these and any other implied questions greatly appreciated.Spend some time on the VIA Rail website, that's where I got my answers to your questions......

A minor terminology point on a great response. Upper and lower berths are or were called sections. Not sectionals. That is a house furniture term, not a railroad term.

 

[user 1215]

Great thread.

I have looked at the VIA website and found it a bit difficult to get answers to some basic questions. Maybe I gave up too easily, but does nay one know simple answers to the following:

Are there different price ranges for different sleeping accommodations, i.e. roomettes versus full bedrooms? How about some kind of "dorm car" with bunks but not private rooms - a place to at least sleep more comfortably than in coach?

Yes. They offer 1) Economy, with three rates depending on how early you book (much like Amtrak's Buckets); 2) Upper Berth; 3) Lower Berth, which are similar to a Superliner roomette but without a wall. You pay for upper or lower, and during the day, the upper is turned up and the lower is the seat for both you and the person sharing the other berth. 4,5,6,7) 0ne, two, three, four person cabins. Each has its own unique configuration not really comparable to anything on Amtrak. Each of the four cabin types have a private toilet. 8) Suite. Think of the former American Orient Express. Up to $6130, and sold for portions of the trip, not the whole length from Toronto to Vancouver. IE: You must book from Toronto to Jasper then Jasper to Vancouver. Just like Amtrak, even the "cheap" sleeper accomodations include added benefits, ie: included meals, access to dome car, shower kit, priority boarding and special parking.

How comfortable is coach for a three day trip? Are coach fares also a lot higher than Amtrak?

The point was made that it less expensive off season.

Though I have never been, I presume it is the same quality of comfort as Amtrak's coach. Three days would be quite long. A quick look at the fares, and I see economy ranging from $530 - $625 for super saver rates, 5/1 & 9/1. Empire Builder from Niagara Falls to Seattle for the same dates $215 for 5/1, $245 for 9/1. Maybe a 20% savings off season?

Is there a rail pass available?

A true shame we lost the North American Rail Pass. Of course, I can see how lopsided it was... Now they have a VIA-only Supersaver Rail Pass. Between June and October, it's $969. October 16 through May, it's $606. Valid for 7 one way trips within 21 days. Upgrades to other classes of service are not permitted.

Is there a difficult "bucket pricing" system as on Amtrak?

Difficult is relative. There are different prices for the same seat depending on when you book it and what the demand for that trip is. Just like Amtrak. Just like Southwest Airlines. Just like just about all forms of transit except a city bus or metro (heck, even the DC metro has a "bucket" system. It's just called peak and off peak fares).

Can you book a LD trip and make some one or two day layover stops without booking separate tickets? Is there a senior discount?

Answers to these and any other implied questions greatly appreciated.

There are Senior discounts only with the Canrailpass. It's about 5% during peak and 10% during off peak. Also, you can have one complimentary layover per trip. Other restrictions and rules apply.

All this is available on the Viarail.ca website. From what I gathered, the Canrailpass is a great deal if you have the stamina to remain in coach for up to 21 days. You'll pay for food and lodging (for your showers!!) so keep that in mind. Berths about double your fare. A room for 2 bring it up an additional 50%. IE: For April 9th, economy discounted fare is around $1100 for 2, upper and lower berths are about $2150, and a cabin for 2 is nearly $3000. Compare that to FULL economy fare on July 2 for two: $1780, upper & lower berth: $3354 and a cabin for two at $4648.

Again, these rates are just for comparison, and they are subject to volatile market conditions like anything else. Look for the "SUPERsaver discounts" generally available in economy only for the best price.

 

[guest]

Thanks very much for all the replies.

I did look at the VIA site some more, and could see most of what has been mentioned. I guess I was intimidated at first but it seems a lot clearer now. Thanks for the encouragement.

That all said, I was horrified at the prices. I had somehow hoped for comparable prices to the Zephyr or Builder, both of which I have taken in the past. With extremely limited income and savings, I had still hoped for another transcontinental rail adventure - but at the existing prices it does not seem likely. Guess I'll try the Empire Builder again, have only done it (roundtrip) once and have done the Zephy 2.5 times. Or maybe this time go one way on each, with a stretch on the CS to connect.

Again, thanks much.

 

[Cristian]

Hello everyone!

Since we're on the VIA Rail topic, does anyone have any updates by any chance on when exactly in 2011 the refurbished sleeping cars for The Canadian are supposed to enter service?

Here's the original press release from 2009: http://www.viarail.c...lity-and-appeal

I am looking forward to trying the Canadian - but I would be looking even more when/if these uber-refurbished cars enter service.

Happy travels,

Cristian

 

[NS VIA Fan]

If you want to experience a classic Budd Stainless-Steel train complete with a Dome Car and the same equipment you would ride on the Canadian (minus the “Park” observation)......and at a fraction of the fare!...... it's VIA's “Chaleur” (now just called the Montreal-Gaspe train) and you can easily do a round-trip in a long weekend. It departs Montreal on Wed, Fri. and Sun evenings......arrives into Gaspe at noon the following day, makes a quick turn and is back in Montreal the following morning.

That’s nearly 2100 kms (roundtrip) of Dome riding......The portion between Matapedia and Gaspe is the most scenic and nearly all in daylight.....650 km (roundtrip) either running along a beach or high on a cliff above the Baie des Chaleurs. Here's a link to a Chaleur winter trip Video.....my favorite time of the year to ride......but the summer is nice too but can be busy. The Gaspe is a resort area.

 

[TraneMan]

Seeing

, I really want to go up there!

 

[Bob Dylan]

:hi: Merci! (0nly French I know! :lol: ) Fantastic trip, Fantastic Video! Another one for the Bucket List for we train buffs! :wub:

 

[NorthCoastHiawatha]

If you want to experience a classic Budd Stainless-Steel train complete with a Dome Car and the same equipment you would ride on the Canadian (minus the “Park” observation)......and at a fraction of the fare!...... it's VIA's “Chaleur” (now just called the Montreal-Gaspe train) and you can easily do a round-trip in a long weekend. It departs Montreal on Wed, Fri. and Sun evenings......arrives into Gaspe at noon the following day, makes a quick turn and is back in Montreal the following morning.

The only problem is for people like me who live on the west coast getting there eats away at the money saved by taking this train instead of the Canadian. Whether I fly to Montreal or take Amtrak it would still cost between 400 to 600 just to get to Montreal and back.

 

[PA Traveler]

The trip across Canada has been on our bucket list for a good while, too. We did the EB last year, hoping that might quell the interest in the VIA Rail's much steeper price, but I don't think it did that. It's still on our list, though, so maybe one of these days. We are looking at alternatives, but since we have two trips planned already this year, it won't be soon. Maybe we would take the EB to Glacier National Park or near there, then rent a car to go into Canada and get on the train for the best part of the VIA Rail. We've also looked at a Caravan Tour that does the best of the trip and stays at some of the best of the hotels. We have time, so we're not looking at it too closely right now, but the information right here makes me think we should look at it a little more seriously again in the future.