When is Sleeping Car returning to WAS-BOS overnight train?

[railiner]

Agreed that this is one train where speed is not at all important. That is why they allow such relatively long dwell times at stations. Plenty of time to handle baggage, and in the past, US Mail and Package Express.

 

[PVD]

If I recall, VL1 is 110 VL2 is 125 Top speed is not an issue for this train.

 

[Tlcooper44]

If I recall, VL1 is 110 VL2 is 125 Top speed is not an issue for this train.

Will then this is simple. The train will top out at 110.
Mystery solved.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

What are Viewliner I's rated at for speed? I doubt the train will get up to 125mph. This trip needs to take 9 hours don't forget.

If the VLI's are rated for 125, then indeed the train will go that fast along the route between BOS and WAS. Without the sleeper, it already goes up to 135 mph in some areas.

And what do you mean by "needs to take 9 hours"?

 

[Tlcooper44]

If the VLI's are rated for 125, then indeed the train will go that fast along the route between BOS and WAS. Without the sleeper, it already goes up to 135 mph in some areas.

And what do you mean by "needs to take 9 hours"?

Viewliner I's as we just learned are rated for 110. I am aware that the NE Regional, along certain corridors, (Rt 128 and Providence section) can reach high speeds.
But given that this is an overnight train, arriving early isn't what one would want, if you are trying to get sleep. It's scheduled from 9:30-6:30, so yes, 9 hours would be ideal.

 

[jis]

I would assume it would operate at the top speeds so 125.

125 if the assigned Sleeper is a VLII, 110 if it is a VLI until the VLIs are cleared for 125 I would presume.

OTOH I don't think any of the trains carrying Sleepers on the NEC (including now65/66/67) really require to hit 125mph to maintain their section times.

 

[fdaley]

I think the 9-hour schedule is the result of long dwell times at major stations, especially NYP but also NHV and PVD, rather than slow running between the stations. It seems mainly a function of offering more attractive times at major stops rather than being time that's necessary for baggage or other work.

 

[NS VIA Fan]

Back in the early 2000s.....VIA's overnight 'Enterprise' between Montreal and Toronto (340 miles) would leave each city around 11:30pm then sit on a siding in the Kingston area (mid point) for 3 hours so it could serve as the first train into the city in the morning for commuters arriving around 8am.

 

[Seaboard92]

Look at the various NightJets they manage to service their markets often with an hour or two long stop somewhere in the middle of the night. While it is true they are doing all sorts of drilling to the consist with parts going to three or more cities usually. The Night Owl is the slowest of all of the Regionals though with a very relaxed timetable.

 

[fdaley]

Back in the early 2000s.....VIA's overnight 'Enterprise' between Montreal and Toronto (340 miles) would leave each city around 11:30pm then sit on a siding in the Kingston area (mid point) for 3 hours so it could serve as the first train into the city in the morning for commuters arriving around 8am.

I loved that train on my one trip on it, I think in 2001. I slept through the layover and enjoyed the continental breakfast in the Park car on the way into Montreal. I also remember that our departure from Toronto was delayed until about midnight as we waited for a delayed connection from the International from Chicago.

 

[Tlcooper44]

I loved that train on my one trip on it, I think in 2001. I slept through the layover and enjoyed the continental breakfast in the Park car on the way into Montreal. I also remember that our departure from Toronto was delayed until about midnight as we waited for a delayed connection from the International from Chicago.

The last time I road the Night Owl was back in 2001 as well. It is an enjoyable service, and I think it will compliment the Acela really well.

 

[Heading North]

Yes it’s great to have something to get excited about—and will be good news especially for getting up to Maine etc. But if it’s truly deadheading WAS-NPN, how much would they really save on an SCA? Some revenue has gotta beat no revenue...

 

[Tlcooper44]

Yes it’s great to have something to get excited about—and will be good news especially for getting up to Maine etc. But if it’s truly deadheading WAS-NPN, how much would they really save on an SCA? Some revenue has gotta beat no revenue...

This is a good question, and I am very curious as well about this. I know for sure a market for BOS-NPN overnight does exist (I myself even have reason to take it), but I suppose that anyone going south can just transfer to buisness class for the remainder of the journey (and northwards people can just transfer at WAS).

My question for all of this is why now? There are obvious possible answers, but I'm curious what everyone else thinks about why they chose to bring back the sleeper during these times, especially when sleeper/LD trains are not doing so hot.

 

[railiner]

Back in the early 2000s.....VIA's overnight 'Enterprise' between Montreal and Toronto (340 miles) would leave each city around 11:30pm then sit on a siding in the Kingston area (mid point) for 3 hours so it could serve as the first train into the city in the morning for commuters arriving around 8am.

Not sure if I would like that method of 'killing time'...
I would prefer if they would simply open the train for early occupancy, and depart later, and still run a leisurely schedule. Or arrive early and allow occupancy to a decent time. That was how The Pullman Company operated.

 

[railiner]

Yes it’s great to have something to get excited about—and will be good news especially for getting up to Maine etc. But if it’s truly deadheading WAS-NPN, how much would they really save on an SCA? Some revenue has gotta beat no revenue...

I wonder if someone was ticketed from Boston to points south of Washington, if they would let them occupy their room beyond Washington, without the attendant? Or would that present a safety or other operating issue? I would imagine they might want to 'make up' the room prior to the attendant leaving. Or the train crew might have to periodically monitor the car, if passenger's were still in it...?

 

[HammerJack]

Agreed that this is one train where speed is not at all important. That is why they allow such relatively long dwell times at stations. Plenty of time to handle baggage, and in the past, US Mail and Package Express.

There is one other train that speed doesn’t matter that I can think of. The Sunset Limited arrival in LAX is, in my opinion, totally okay to arrive late. In fact, I’d rather get off at 7:30 AM than 5:35 AM lol. Anyways, back on topic.

 

[NES28]

A few days ago there was discussion of sleeping cars, comparing European vs. U.S. standards of privacy. People should watch this High Speed Rail Alliance webinar originally presented March 5, 2021 hosted by Kurt Bauer, Director, High Speed and Long Distance Passenger Services and New Rail Business, OBB. OBB now operates most of the sleeping car services in Europe. He describes, and shows photos of, the new overnight trainsets (i.e. several cars semi-permanently coupled together), now being delivered Brown Bag Lunch: OBB on Operating Austrian Passenger Rail
. It turns out that Europeans are no longer comfortable sharing open compartments with strangers either. In the new cars even the lowest-priced sleeping cubicles are fully lockable. Lots of interesting discussion.

 

[Tlcooper44]

A few days ago there was discussion of sleeping cars, comparing European vs. U.S. standards of privacy. People should watch this High Speed Rail Alliance webinar originally presented March 5, 2021 hosted by Kurt Bauer, Director, High Speed and Long Distance Passenger Services and New Rail Business, OBB. OBB now operates most of the sleeping car services in Europe. He describes, and shows photos of, the new overnight trainsets (i.e. several cars semi-permanently coupled together), now being delivered Brown Bag Lunch: OBB on Operating Austrian Passenger Rail
. It turns out that Europeans are no longer comfortable sharing open compartments with strangers either. In the new cars even the lowest-priced sleeping cubicles are fully lockable. Lots of interesting discussion.

Can 100% recommend this, as well as all of the webinars the hsrail.org puts on.
All of them are very informative.

 

[jiml]

I wonder if someone was ticketed from Boston to points south of Washington, if they would let them occupy their room beyond Washington, without the attendant? Or would that present a safety or other operating issue? I would imagine they might want to 'make up' the room prior to the attendant leaving. Or the train crew might have to periodically monitor the car, if passenger's were still in it...?

I wondered that same thing myself. At the very least you'd move to the BC car, unless two separate tickets were required.

 

[jis]

Agreed that this is one train where speed is not at all important. That is why they allow such relatively long dwell times at stations. Plenty of time to handle baggage, and in the past, US Mail and Package Express.

Did you notice that 65/66/67 has a significantly faster schedule between NYP and WAS than the Silvers or the Crescent?

 

[jis]

I wondered that same thing myself. At the very least you'd move to the BC car, unless two separate tickets were required.

If the reservation system programmed to say that there is no Sleeper service south of WAS it will of course not issue a Sleeper ticket south of WAS. It has no idea about whether there is a deadhead Sleeping car in the consist or not. It will in all likelihood issue two tickets.

OTOH, if it is programmed to say that there is Sleeper service south of WAS, but no boarding is allowed southbound from WAS and south, then one could get a single ticket. It is all upto what policy is programmed into the rez system.

 

[Cal]

125 if the assigned Sleeper is a VLII, 110 if it is a VLI until the VLIs are cleared for 125 I would presume.

OTOH I don't think any of the trains carrying Sleepers on the NEC (including now65/66/67) really require to hit 125mph to maintain their section times.

I thought the VI was rated for 125, whoops

 

[jis]

I thought the VI was rated for 125, whoops

They were supposed to get uprated. I am not sure if that was completed. Maybe someone closer to NEC ops knows for sure.

 

[Cal]

\

Did you notice that 65/66/67 has a significantly faster schedule between NYP and WAS than the Silvers or the Crescent?

Well the LD trains have a top speed of 110 due to the VI's, so I would assume that would account for a few minutes. Plus padding?

EDIT:

They were supposed to get uprated. I am not sure if that was completed. Maybe someone closer to NEC ops knows for sure.

Got it

 

[jis]

Well the LD trains have a top speed of 110 due to the VI's, so I would assume that would account for a few minutes. Plus padding?

What is even more interesting is that the block time between NYP and WAS has changed relatively little for the Florida trains or the Crescent since 1950, when there was not much official 110mph either

At least the Florida trains were much faster South of WAS, but not between NYP and WAS, and they are only very marginally faster between NYP and WAS now than back then!