EB mess

[CHamilton]

PDX has gotten quite a bit of snow, which caused frozen switches and delayed or cancelled several Cascades trains (as well as freight, and, I assume, 28). We even got a little snow here in SEA last night.

 

[CHamilton]

The AP story that Steve linked to above is making the rounds, here in the Seattle P-I website.

http://www.seattlepi.com/news/texas/article/ND-oil-freight-shipments-detour-Amtrak-trains-5218642.php

 

[EB_OBS]

anybody know the deal with 28 out of pdx yesterday. looked like they didn't have the protect set available as 28 apparently had to wait for 27 to arrive and be turned. it's now very late. 8 left sea on time yesterday and evidently has been waiting in spk for 28????

#28 waited in PDX, for four hours, for the late Coast Starlight. Then promptly encountered an additional two hour delay due to freight congestion and frozen switches.

 

[TraneMan]

Waiting in the Metro lounge and they just announced the mechanical

Shop said that 7 is delayed an hour.

-Sent from my iPad using Amtrak Forum App.

 

[montana mike]

#7 and #8 in western MT now 8 and 13 hours late--just one of those days I guess.

:-((

 

[TraneMan]

Now been told 5:15

-Sent from my iPad using Amtrak Forum App.

 

[TraneMan]

We pulled out of CUS at 5:50. At last!

-Sent from my iPhone 5 using Amtrak Forum App,

 

[diesteldorf]

Waiting in the Metro lounge and they just announced the mechanical

Shop said that 7 is delayed an hour.

-Sent from my iPad using Amtrak Forum App.

For those that don't know, I used to regularly ride the Builder out of La Crosse, WI going to Chicago and from Chicago back to La Crosse.

Up until last week, they were regularly running buses for those riding from St Paul to Chicago. For whatever reason, they decided to stop any further bustitutions. I can understand that this was probably monitarily costly for Amtrak, but was, in my mind, a necessary evil.

Unfortunately, we were booked on #8 on Saturday, Feb 1st from LSE to CHI, connecting to the City of New Orleans to catch a cruise ship that Monday. I didn't receive any notification that there was no alternate transportation until 9:42 Saturday morning via email, only an hour before departure.

This resulted in the person I was traveling with having to drive from La Crosse to Milwaukee, at the last minute, to catch the 3:00 PM Hiawatha.

In spite of everything, I had a great cruise, and will most definitely ride Amtrak in the future. However, I still plan to call customer relations this week. I would've appreciated more than an hour notice, especially when bustitutions had been running regularly during previous weeks.

 

[Nathanael]

FWIW, there is now a service alert up. Someone listened. Thank you, anonymous Amtrak website/communications person.

 

[jebr]

I also saw this at the SCD station yesterday. It's a start, though I only got a call for my final RDW - SCD segment (even though that was way closer to on-time than any of my eastbound segments.)

 

[Bob Dylan]

Let's face it folks, Chicago has become the Black Hole of Amtrak! Maybe Amtrak should just Cancel ALL Trains until Winter is Over, this will give them time to Perform required Mechanical Repairs, Inspections etc., to, Hire OBS and T&E Crew to fill the Empty Extra Boards and for Joe Boardman and the 60 Mass Braintrust to Select some Execs with Railroad Management Skills (not Bean Counters or Politicians) that can come in and "Kick *** and Take Names!"

I was hoping the New Mangers in Chicago would Make a Difference but the Whole Operation Has Become a Cluster Flub and it's Not BNSF or the Oil Companies Fault for what's happening on the Routes that aren't the Hi-Line! (the Extreme Weather we Understand but it's Much More than that, it's a Total Failure of Management!) YMMV

 

[montana mike]

I am not a rail person, but I would have to agree something may be awry in CHI. The ability of that hub to service and turn the trains in a reasonable amount of time appears to have broken down. Yes, the Empire Builders are dragging in 4, 6, 8 hours late for example, but that still gives the folks in CHI plenty of time to ready a train set for the next day's run--I would think. Perhaps I am missing something here, and I welcome any additional insight in this regard, but the weather and the BNSF issues cannot account for all of the issues that have surfaced.

:-(

 

[yarrow]

http://missoulian.com/news/state-and-regional/n-d-oil-freight-shipments-detour-amtrak-trains-derail-ice/article_97ee771c-919c-11e3-a2dc-001a4bcf887a.html

ice fishing derailed

 

[Steve Manfred]

I've been watching the status of the train I was going to use to get part of the way to Los Angeles. Empire Builder #7 that left yesterday (Feb 9). Boy, am I glad I cancelled this trip. Already 8 hours behind and not even out of Minnesota yet.

 

[montana mike]

In all of my years of riding the Empire Builders I don't recall seeing anything quite like this-and things continue to get worse too. The "routine" is now becoming 8-12 hours late into CHI and even the west coast arrivals are averaging 4-6 hours late, with some even more than 8. I had a "heart-to-heart" with one of my local BNSF buddies this weekend and he said BNSF is having soooooooo much trouble moving its own freight now that the system is very close to grid lock at times. He also stated, for the record, that senior management was well aware of the increased traffic forecasts well over two years ago and chose to "bank current profits" then and not invest in the infrastructure that was needed to support the forecasts at the time. He said this decision was made not by BNSF, but by their Berkshire Hathaway owners. Mr Buffett is laughing all the way to the bank on this one.

 

[Ryan]

He also stated, for the record, that senior management was well aware of the increased traffic forecasts well over two years ago and chose to "bank current profits" then and not invest in the infrastructure that was needed to support the forecasts at the time. He said this decision was made not by BNSF, but by their Berkshire Hathaway owners. Mr Buffett is laughing all the way to the bank on this one.

THAT is the group of people that I'm pissed at. I'm willing to be that said senior management doesn't live anywhere near there and couldn't possibly care less that their decisions are screwing over thousands of people that just want to get from Point A to Point B in a reasonable fashion.

I also saw this at the SCD station yesterday. It's a start, though I only got a call for my final RDW - SCD segment (even though that was way closer to on-time than any of my eastbound segments.)

The dates in the fine print at the bottom amuse me.

 

[montana mike]

This all goes back to having "non-railroad" people owning and running a railroad. Clearly the bean counters and "suits" at BH don't have a clue as to how to run this railroad and have made a mess of things in their first several years' of ownership. All of my local BNSF contacts have told me for quite some time now that the career BNSF people were telling their new owners of the "train wreck" (pardon the pun) that was going to happen, but the powers that be at BH HQ basically ignored them and kept referring to them only as one of their "profit centers". It was ONLY when BNSF was getting some really bad national press in the media that these "suits" started paying attention to the mess they had created.

PS--I agree, interesting "fine print" on that notice!!!

 

[Nathanael]

He also stated, for the record, that senior management was well aware of the increased traffic forecasts well over two years ago and chose to "bank current profits" then and not invest in the infrastructure that was needed to support the forecasts at the time. He said this decision was made not by BNSF, but by their Berkshire Hathaway owners. Mr Buffett is laughing all the way to the bank on this one.

This is a very stupid error. First rule of railroads is don't underinvest in the infrastructure; I figured that out decades back. This mistake is going to lose Buffett several billion dollars.

Frankly, Buffett appears to know better than that, because he specified when he bought the railroad (in his annual letter) that it was extremely capital-intensive. Which raises the question of who, below Buffett and above middle management, didn't understand this.

 

[montana mike]

If you know anything about BH the buck does indeed stop with WB and his handpicked inner circle. He has known all along what is going on. He also takes the train (his special private cars--verrrrrry nice) fairly often--He was in WFH for example, several times in 2013 and was even caught in some of the energy slow downs as well. You are absolutely right about their total lack of vision in not investing in their infrastructure. But then again, my friends and contacts here locally have seen that since the day BNSF was sold to BH. It was two years before anyone at BH HQ would even acknowledge the lack of improvements. BH was squeezing every penny they could out of BNSF without spending anything (or at least not spending what they should have). They are scrambling to try to catch up now, but as ALL of my "locals" say, they are a "day late and a few billion short".

:-((

 

[Ispolkom]

I often heard that BNSF stands for "Brand New Santa Fe." I wonder if the railroad's focus on improving the Southern Transcon made it short-change the Hi Line, or if management just couldn't focus on two major construction projects at once.

 

[Tumbleweed]

(tinfoil hat on) We're headed for a government takeover h34r: (tinfoil hat off)

 

[Karl1459]

This all goes back to having "non-railroad" people owning and running a railroad. Clearly the bean counters and "suits" at BH don't have a clue as to how to run this railroad and have made a mess of things in their first several years' of ownership. All of my local BNSF contacts have told me for quite some time now that the career BNSF people were telling their new owners of the "train wreck" (pardon the pun) that was going to happen, but the powers that be at BH HQ basically ignored them and kept referring to them only as one of their "profit centers". It was ONLY when BNSF was getting some really bad national press in the media that these "suits" started paying attention to the mess they had created.

PS--I agree, interesting "fine print" on that notice!!!

A wise teacher once remarked to their students "A few of you will be alert enough to learn from the mistakes of others... The rest will have to learn from their own."

 

[Guest]

So if the eastbound builders get into Chicago in the middle of the night, does the train start getting serviced right away or not until the morning?

 

[Nathanael]

If you know anything about BH the buck does indeed stop with WB and his handpicked inner circle.

I would certainly expect his inner circle to make poor decisions. It's the fact that he personally wrote a letter stating explicitly that he understood that a railroad needed huge capital investments that seems to be in contrast to the results.

He has known all along what is going on. He also takes the train (his special private cars--verrrrrry nice) fairly often--He was in WFH for example, several times in 2013 and was even caught in some of the energy slow downs as well.

Maybe (sigh) he did the usual thing of paying no real attention to the business after he bought it.

You are absolutely right about their total lack of vision in not investing in their infrastructure. But then again, my friends and contacts here locally have seen that since the day BNSF was sold to BH. It was two years before anyone at BH HQ would even acknowledge the lack of improvements.

The way the businesses are normally run at BH, it's quite frankly up to the individual managements whether to send cash back to BH or not.

The utility companies sometimes decide not to, and the insurance subsidiaries sometimes don't either.

Which leads me to pin the blame on Matt Rose & Carl Ice. They could have said, "We need the cash, we're keeping it."

Was there some fear among Matt Rose and Carl Ice that if they decided not to issue dividends to BH for a few years, the "boss" would be unhappy? I've seen people doing crazy things out of fears which aren't actually accurate.

 

[montana mike]

In real life Mt Buffett is NO "Teddy Bear" as is often seen in his public persona. He didn't get to be one of the richest persons in the world by being nice to everyone-he is a clever, cool, calculating and determined driver of people and companies (often into the ground I might add--the record speaks for itself). My guess is that there was a promise by senior management to start paying BH back (WB paid a fairly high price for the BNSF) as soon as they could and they likely figured they could get away with little or no reinvestment in infrastructure for a few years. If I was WB I would have fired the SOBs for this!

This BNSF SNAFU will be used by business schools for years as an excellent example of how NOT to do things............

Footnote from another source just in as I write this (good timing): I have a very good friend who owns a significant oil field services firm in the Bakken area. He is high enough up in the "food chain" there to be able to share with me that BNSF management was informed of exactly what was going to happen as far as transportation needs and production levels several years ago and he said the BNSF people just blew him and the others in ND off, saying that the energy people were way off the mark and BNSF had plenty of capacity to meet their needs for years. This despite even the state of ND reps at these same meetings pleading with BNSF to listen to the energy people. Bummer.........