Pacific Parlour Car Permanently Retired February 2018
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ChuckL
Service Attendant
That link works and I can fill out an order. However after filling out the customer information you’re told to press the Save button and there isn’t one. I’ve emailed their customer help desk.
Addendum: They just responded back and said that if you are using a tablet or mobile device instead of a computer, the bottom of the screen might be chopped off.
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ChuckL
Service Attendant
Addendum 2:I found out that when using an iPhone, you can click on the Go button instead of Done after filling out the information form and it does the same as what the Save button would do. It takes you to the next screen where you can enter your billing information.
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Their e-commerce software is awful, and has been for some time.
Surprised at the lack of discussion/activity in this thread, given that the final trips are underway.
The last northbound, 11(2), arrived in Seattle tonight a few minute early. As noted in another thread, there were two Parlour Cars.
In typical Amtrak fashion, the crew on the train wasn't expecting a second Parlour, and also didn't realize that all sleeper passengers had been given a letter noting the special final trip and announcing that wine tasting was free. Nonetheless, they adapted, and were great about it (none of them, nor any passengers I spoke with, had ever seen two Pacific Parlour cars together, in service, before).
Initially, the second Parlour Car was just supposed to be overflow seating, but once they realized how many passengers were interested, they wound up offering meals and wine tasting in both cars (they ran out of wine glasses because they were unprepared for a free tasting, not realizing how many would participate, so they had to use regular water glasses on the first day and plastic cups on the second day).
We had CJ and Darren in the Parlours (the latter who, I gather, was supposed to be the dining car LSA, but wound up becoming the second Parlour LSA with someone else in the diner serving as LSA, though I don't know if I have that 100% accurate).
Many passengers came to say their goodbyes on the trip (a few on the northbound are planning to head right back southbound tomorrow). I met a few current and former AU-ers on the train (some expectedly, some unexpectedly), and a few other folks that knew people that I knew. Small world.
Some folks, both passengers and crew, did become a bit emotional when discussing the end of Parlour Car service, which is understandable given that some of the younger passengers on the train basically grew up with the cars, and some of the crew spent most (or all) of their careers working on or around the Parlour cars.
One gentleman on the train brought brochures and a ticket receipt from the El Capitan in 1969, which was the last time he had ridden in one of those cars. Another guy was a journalism student talking to crew and passengers and taking lots of photos and video to document the final northbound run.
The farewell letter left in each sleeper room pointed out that these particular cars spent more time in service as the Pacific Parlour Car (23 years) than they did with the ATSF (15 years).
Overall, one couldn't have asked for a better Starlight trip, with excellent crews and an on-time arrival into Seattle (though we were a bit late at some of the Northern California stops). Many people were griping about the relative suddenness of their elimination and lack of time to prepare for a proper send-off. Others lamented not so much the elimination of that specific equipment, but more the fact that there will no longer be a dedicated sleeper lounge on the train.
Technically, the cars still have two days of service left, but right now, it really feels like the end of an era. Not just of pre-Amtrak equipment in regular Amtrak service, not just of the Hi-Level Pacific Parlour Car equipment, but of (perhaps?) the last real bastion of premium service on a regularly scheduled passenger train in the United States. I'm not saying this is a bad thing, or a good thing. It is a thing. As I've noted earlier in the thread, it could very well be that "Premium Service" no longer really sells enough in a sustainable manner to offer proper returns. The reality of the current paradigm (which, really, has been becoming more and more evident) is that Amtrak has to fight harder and harder to justify its expenditures. It's always lamentable when things we know and have come to love cease to be. But that doesn't mean that things should just keep going the way they were, just because.
Will eliminating the Parlour Cars improve or harm Amtrak's overall financial condition? It's hard to say. Will Amtrak's critics be less critical with one less fancy service being offered. Almost definitely not. Should we care? About the latter, not really. About the former, certainly.
In the end, I'm glad I spent my weekend on this train, but when I put emotion and rumor aside, it's really difficult to say what move was the best move was for Amtrak to make, given the context of the situation in which it exists today.
The last northbound, 11(2), arrived in Seattle tonight a few minute early. As noted in another thread, there were two Parlour Cars.
In typical Amtrak fashion, the crew on the train wasn't expecting a second Parlour, and also didn't realize that all sleeper passengers had been given a letter noting the special final trip and announcing that wine tasting was free. Nonetheless, they adapted, and were great about it (none of them, nor any passengers I spoke with, had ever seen two Pacific Parlour cars together, in service, before).
Initially, the second Parlour Car was just supposed to be overflow seating, but once they realized how many passengers were interested, they wound up offering meals and wine tasting in both cars (they ran out of wine glasses because they were unprepared for a free tasting, not realizing how many would participate, so they had to use regular water glasses on the first day and plastic cups on the second day).
We had CJ and Darren in the Parlours (the latter who, I gather, was supposed to be the dining car LSA, but wound up becoming the second Parlour LSA with someone else in the diner serving as LSA, though I don't know if I have that 100% accurate).
Many passengers came to say their goodbyes on the trip (a few on the northbound are planning to head right back southbound tomorrow). I met a few current and former AU-ers on the train (some expectedly, some unexpectedly), and a few other folks that knew people that I knew. Small world.
Some folks, both passengers and crew, did become a bit emotional when discussing the end of Parlour Car service, which is understandable given that some of the younger passengers on the train basically grew up with the cars, and some of the crew spent most (or all) of their careers working on or around the Parlour cars.
One gentleman on the train brought brochures and a ticket receipt from the El Capitan in 1969, which was the last time he had ridden in one of those cars. Another guy was a journalism student talking to crew and passengers and taking lots of photos and video to document the final northbound run.
The farewell letter left in each sleeper room pointed out that these particular cars spent more time in service as the Pacific Parlour Car (23 years) than they did with the ATSF (15 years).
Overall, one couldn't have asked for a better Starlight trip, with excellent crews and an on-time arrival into Seattle (though we were a bit late at some of the Northern California stops). Many people were griping about the relative suddenness of their elimination and lack of time to prepare for a proper send-off. Others lamented not so much the elimination of that specific equipment, but more the fact that there will no longer be a dedicated sleeper lounge on the train.
Technically, the cars still have two days of service left, but right now, it really feels like the end of an era. Not just of pre-Amtrak equipment in regular Amtrak service, not just of the Hi-Level Pacific Parlour Car equipment, but of (perhaps?) the last real bastion of premium service on a regularly scheduled passenger train in the United States. I'm not saying this is a bad thing, or a good thing. It is a thing. As I've noted earlier in the thread, it could very well be that "Premium Service" no longer really sells enough in a sustainable manner to offer proper returns. The reality of the current paradigm (which, really, has been becoming more and more evident) is that Amtrak has to fight harder and harder to justify its expenditures. It's always lamentable when things we know and have come to love cease to be. But that doesn't mean that things should just keep going the way they were, just because.
Will eliminating the Parlour Cars improve or harm Amtrak's overall financial condition? It's hard to say. Will Amtrak's critics be less critical with one less fancy service being offered. Almost definitely not. Should we care? About the latter, not really. About the former, certainly.
In the end, I'm glad I spent my weekend on this train, but when I put emotion and rumor aside, it's really difficult to say what move was the best move was for Amtrak to make, given the context of the situation in which it exists today.
Thirdrail7
Engineer
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2014
- Messages
- 4,542
Thank you for that well written report,Trogdor. It amazing that members of this board knew about the double parlor car operation and the operating crew didn't.
Actually, I'm somehow not that surprised.
Actually, I'm somehow not that surprised.
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So, I got to talk with the service manager...the second PPC was apparently cobbled together with much arm-twisting out of LAX (and comments of "No, an extra SSL will NOT cut it").
There are some trip-only merch sales going on (mugs, posters, teddy bears, and luggage tags; there may be some additional stuff tomorrow as well depending on the whims of FedEx), and the wine tastings have been free (cheese and crackers are still extra, but the wine is included).
Amtrak has definitely put their best foot forward with this trip...
...but boy, am I going to need a few days to work through this when it's all over. I am not going to be in the mood for dealing with wild rumors or crises of the future of Amtrak for a little while.
There are some trip-only merch sales going on (mugs, posters, teddy bears, and luggage tags; there may be some additional stuff tomorrow as well depending on the whims of FedEx), and the wine tastings have been free (cheese and crackers are still extra, but the wine is included).
Amtrak has definitely put their best foot forward with this trip...
...but boy, am I going to need a few days to work through this when it's all over. I am not going to be in the mood for dealing with wild rumors or crises of the future of Amtrak for a little while.
Thirdrail7
Engineer
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2014
- Messages
- 4,542
But it is such sport!
rtabern
Conductor
Just got home from a quick whilwind trip to ride the last northbound from Salem to Seattle. It looks like Trogdor, myself, my wife and another AU'er get the distinction of the final northbound dinner in the PPC.
I do wish there was more notice as many have said. Having an employer that requires time off be put in 4 weeks out and Amtrak giving only a 2 week notice meant for a long day of flying out on Saturday and riding up to Seattle. But we would do it again in a heartbeat.
As Trogdor said the crew was great. Everyone who wanted dinner in the PPC got it I believe. They did wine tastings in both cars at least on Saturday. And yes no one told the crews about the second car. I guess there was quite the backorder at Seattle for #11(04) for food and booze.
I am going to be writing a series of three articles for Trainweb.com about the cars. I can share them on here if people are interested.
Like I said... I don't see myself really riding the Starlight anymore. If I really have go Seattle to LA I will fly because it's two hours vs two days. The scenery is still great even without a PPC but we have done it enough in recent years. I am not going to spend $1200 for a bedroom not to have it not be ocean side and then have to fight for the 20 seats in the Sightseer. And if I really want to see the ocean I will rent a car and drive to a secluded beach to enjoy the time... just my wife and I. I see Amtrak trips mainly being on the dome (while it is still around and I know about it in advance)... trips in the Northeast where driving is a pain in the ass... and maybe between places like Chicago and KC where the train is faster given the highway grids.
I do wish there was more notice as many have said. Having an employer that requires time off be put in 4 weeks out and Amtrak giving only a 2 week notice meant for a long day of flying out on Saturday and riding up to Seattle. But we would do it again in a heartbeat.
As Trogdor said the crew was great. Everyone who wanted dinner in the PPC got it I believe. They did wine tastings in both cars at least on Saturday. And yes no one told the crews about the second car. I guess there was quite the backorder at Seattle for #11(04) for food and booze.
I am going to be writing a series of three articles for Trainweb.com about the cars. I can share them on here if people are interested.
Like I said... I don't see myself really riding the Starlight anymore. If I really have go Seattle to LA I will fly because it's two hours vs two days. The scenery is still great even without a PPC but we have done it enough in recent years. I am not going to spend $1200 for a bedroom not to have it not be ocean side and then have to fight for the 20 seats in the Sightseer. And if I really want to see the ocean I will rent a car and drive to a secluded beach to enjoy the time... just my wife and I. I see Amtrak trips mainly being on the dome (while it is still around and I know about it in advance)... trips in the Northeast where driving is a pain in the ass... and maybe between places like Chicago and KC where the train is faster given the highway grids.
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ChuckL
Service Attendant
rtabern
Conductor
Here is the first of three articles we are writing for TrainWeb on the Parlour Cars. In the coming weeks, we are going to do a trip report for our last run on February 3rd and then another report on the "missing" PPC #39971 sold off in 2001.
http://www.trainweb.org/outsidetherails/PPCHistory2018/
Enjoy!
http://www.trainweb.org/outsidetherails/PPCHistory2018/
Enjoy!
Nice article Rob!
Look forward to the next reports!
RIP Pacific Parlour Cars!
Look forward to the next reports!
RIP Pacific Parlour Cars!
ChuckL
Service Attendant
Very nice and informative article on the history of these unique treasures which I enjoyed on the El Capitan in 1968 and as Pacific Parlour Cars in 2013 and 2017. Amtrak MAY decide to attempt to replicate some features of the PPC on the Coast Starlight, but they cannot replicate the history and many passenger’s memories of these beauties. I am anxiously awaiting the next two reports and thank you for sharing these with us!
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Sent from my iPhone using Amtrak Forum
Thank you for sharing your excellent report with us, Rob. I truly enjoyed all the facts and photos. Even the one with me in it!
I'm looking forward to article two and three.
Mike
I'm looking forward to article two and three.
Mike
dogbert617
OBS Chief
This is super sad news.
I never quite to ride a PPC, before those were retired. But I guess if the reports are true about their age, I can see why they're finally being retired. I at least hope the PPCs aren't scrapped, and that those cars are reused somehow.
Side question: anyone know how much longer the Coast Starlight and Cascades trains will use the old track route south of Tacoma, since the new route was temporarily taken out of service after that derailment? I wonder if I were to do a USA Rail Pass trip later this year, if I'd have enough time to ride the Coast Starlight going north to Seattle(and then the Empire east back to Chicago) before Amtrak trains stop using that route.
Side question: anyone know how much longer the Coast Starlight and Cascades trains will use the old track route south of Tacoma, since the new route was temporarily taken out of service after that derailment? I wonder if I were to do a USA Rail Pass trip later this year, if I'd have enough time to ride the Coast Starlight going north to Seattle(and then the Empire east back to Chicago) before Amtrak trains stop using that route.
Green Maned Lion
Engineer
They were built 65+ years ago and have had the tar beaten out of them in Amtraks service, and I believe equally so in El Capitan service (6 sets, six cars, daily service). So yeah, the age is quite true.
So, I got to be in the final NB dinner seating in the PPC. The final dinner seating in the SB PPC sold out before they got around to me (though I did have lunch there yesterday, so that's something). I think I did manage to close out the bar, however (though they let us stay in the PPC all the way into LAX, which was nice).
WoodyinNYC
Conductor
iirc The target date for the bypass is April, but I don't think it has a specific date yet. It is supposed to happen when the PTC is up and tested and working. A delay is possible, of course. But I wouldn't count on using the old route after April.This is super sad news.
Side question: anyone know how much longer the Coast Starlight and Cascades trains will use the old track route south of Tacoma, since the new route was temporarily taken out of service after that derailment? I wonder if I were to do a USA Rail Pass trip later this year, if I'd have enough time to ride the Coast Starlight going north to Seattle(and then the Empire east back to Chicago) before Amtrak trains stop using that route.
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Yes, but:
(1) It's not the PPC and it's in Canada (which is a mild pain to get to);
(2) Outside of the occasional "Budd extra", the food service on the Ocean is rather constrained by the kitchen facilities onboard; and
(3) I'll take the Canadian over the Ocean most days because of (2) and because of the better scenery.
By the way, there were all sorts of rumors about the disposition of the PPCs going forward. One such rumor is that, following the N-S MSBL fiasco, LOSSAN is looking at grabbing the Hi-Level sets so they can get rid of the oddball Amfleet/Horizon equipment (which would make some sense insofar as the MSBLs becoming single-level cars does represent a capacity hit for all parties involved...rehabbing 62-year-old equipment doesn't make that much sense, but neither does having a screwball high-level-boarding/inherently-lower-capacity trainset...which apparently causes problems with having to turn pax away at times), which they seem to really want to get rid of. There were other wild rumors about the cars having already been sold to a private buyer, etc. (and some of the rumor sets weren't mutually exclusive...the St. Louis people who own the other hi-levels acquiring them in the context of then being able to arrange a multi-year lease or sale with LOSSAN would also make sense, and this would not be the first time that CA had done something rather odd to try and get some extra capacity out there given that they're running the Comaro sets on the San Joaquin).
Devil's Advocate
⠀⠀⠀
Anywhere except the border crossing areas. Canadian customs and immigration has made it clear they don't want my tourist dollars and at this point I'm only too happy to oblige them. Even when I'm simply passing through from one foreign country to another they find a way to make the midpoint inspection process as tedious and annoying as possible.
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