Superliner trains' removal and restoration of cars (2022-2023)

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I’d personally rather see them reduce the availability of inventory months out until they know for sure they can add a car before opening up more inventory. Though that probably wouldn’t fly for revenue and yield management reasons.
But they did do that with the Cap Ltd. There was only 1 sleeper available for Sept., until they added a 2nd one a couple of weeks ago.

Unfortunately, the SuperStar and the upcoming Silver Meteor suffered the same fate as the western trains, suddenly losing a sleeper that had already been booked. Perhaps a shortage of Viewliner sleepers or eastern OBS caught them off guard.
 
So they didn't have a headcount of Florida crews until now? Just like they didn't have one in Chicago for the Zephyr until early August?

Yep, that's some planning going on there, all right.
People are known to quit their jobs, especially since the pandemic started. Even if they give 2 weeks notice it takes much more time than that to hire & train new employees.
 
People are known to quit their jobs, especially since the pandemic started. Even if they give 2 weeks notice it takes much more time than that to hire & train new employees.
Yes, but they know there is turnover, and they probably have a reasonable handle on the post-COVID rate of turnover/attrition at this point.

They should have released inventory based on a bad/worst case scenario instead of an optimistic one.

You sound like they should be surprised people quit. They should not be, if they are it reflects poorly on their management skills. They ought to have a have a handle on the attrition rates in the recent and current environments, their hiring and on boarding rates and make their staffing and inventory plans accordingly.
 
If it was happening in isolation, to Amtrak only, you might have a point. But literally the entire universe is having staffing problems and as bas as you think Amtrak management may be, I doubt that they're bad enough to see the universal staffing issues we're seeing both inside and outside of Amtrak.

But by all means, continue to rant about how bad management is with nothing to back it up. It's entertaining to read.
 
While a direct comment by executives may be well received by those of us that follow Amtrak closely it’s probably not going to make a difference to the more casual person who gets downgraded and doesnt follow Amtrak as much.
I seem to recall that a number of senior airline executives did appear in the national media and apologize for the airline meltdown. That did not solve the problem but at least it was clear that they were aware of the problem. I don't recall anything similar from senior Amtrak officials. Perhaps they have been too busy staring in disbelief at their recent bonus checks.

The Amtrak meltdown over the past few months speaks for itself. Res Ipsa Loquitur.
 
We had our sleeper car removed from the CZ, Denver to Emeryville. After seeing a post here I checked out roomette availability and lo and behold there were 3 roomettes available from Grand Junction. Just changed our reservations to coach from Denver to Grand Junction and a roomette from Grand Junction to Emeryville. Saved about 150 overall. Travelling on 9/14.
 
I seem to recall that a number of senior airline executives did appear in the national media and apologize for the airline meltdown. That did not solve the problem but at least it was clear that they were aware of the problem. I don't recall anything similar from senior Amtrak officials. Perhaps they have been too busy staring in disbelief at their recent bonus checks.

The Amtrak meltdown over the past few months speaks for itself. Res Ipsa Loquitur.
Meltdown at Amtrak Chicago and the related routes - yes. Meltdown at Amtrak across the board - I don't agree.
 
We had our sleeper car removed from the CZ, Denver to Emeryville. After seeing a post here I checked out roomette availability and lo and behold there were 3 roomettes available from Grand Junction. Just changed our reservations to coach from Denver to Grand Junction and a roomette from Grand Junction to Emeryville. Saved about 150 overall. Travelling on 9/14.
I assume Amtrak never presented that option to you when you were downgraded (assuming it was available and maybe it wasn't). You had to find this option yourself.
 
Meltdown at Amtrak Chicago and the related routes - yes. Meltdown at Amtrak across the board - I don't agree.
Since Chicago is the hub of most of the long distance network, that is a pretty significant meltdown. The "related routes" are most of the sleeper routes which are the actual subject of this thread.

That the NEC didn't experience a meltdown is unsurprising, since nothing else counts.

I'll repeat what @Rasputin said, Res Ipsa Loquitur.
 
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I do wish some of the agents would think a bit outside the box - this sort of thing can be a good solution for some people.
I’ve seen station agents do this for people before. Talked to one passenger on the train (bought a last minute ticket) who said the agent was able to get him on a roomette for part of the trip, Coach for the rest.
 
Meltdown at Amtrak Chicago and the related routes - yes. Meltdown at Amtrak across the board - I don't agree.
Since Chicago is the hub of most if the long distance network, that is a pretty significant meltdown. The "related routes" are most of the sleeper routes which are the actual subject of this thread.

That the NEC didn't experience a meltdown is unsurprising, since nothing else counts.

I think the Sleeper fiasco has little to do with Chicago per se. It is just that staffing did not recover as fast as had been planned, for whatever reason. I think handling of it has been sub par and part of the reason may be because of the broken CRS system, which apparently has very little automated notification working about anything.

NEC has had its moments with cancellations too, but when a route has dozens of services a day, such become less disruptive overall.
 
I assume Amtrak never presented that option to you when you were downgraded (assuming it was available and maybe it wasn't). You had to find this option yourself.
I don't think Amtrak is doing anything to (automatically) mitigate the situation for downgraded passengers.

I was downgraded (Emeryville - LA - Chicago) from Bedroom to Coach on the SWC in June and it was myself whilst on hold waiting for an agent who found an alternative (Emeryville - Chicago) a Roomette on the CZ.

Similarly having again been downgraded from Bedroom to Coach on my upcoming September booking CZ from Sacramento to Chicago - it was me that found an alternative Sacramento - LA - Chicago where there was a roomette available on the SWC.

(Subsequently I have seen both Bedroom and Roomette availability on my originally booked September CZ train - I presume there was no attempt to offer those accommodations to downgraded passengers before listing them as available for new bookers).
 
Doing anything tricky (shifting routes, changing room occupancy to only part of the route) is probably beyond the capability of automation, and would need the passenger's approval.

Doing something like that will require a person. A few years ago, when Amtrak actually called you to notify you of a change, you could have worked it out then. Now, it requires that an agent handle it, and likely with the passenger having to do the legwork of finding the alternative.
 
Doing anything tricky (shifting routes, changing room occupancy to only part of the route) is probably beyond the capability of automation, and would need the passenger's approval.

Doing something like that will require a person. A few years ago, when Amtrak actually called you to notify you of a change, you could have worked it out then. Now, it requires that an agent handle it, and likely with the passenger having to do the legwork of finding the alternative.
Just to give an example of what is possible if one has a functional IT system ....

On my way out to India the Newark to Delhi leg got cancelled due to mechanical. As soon as the cancellation happened, while we were still sitting in the plane at the gate I got an SMS instructing me to call a number, different from any of the standard published number. It was answered and as usual I was placed in a queue, but within 10 minutes I was talking to a lady who presented me with two alternatives, one of which disappeared while we were talking as one of the flights got filled up. So I agreed to the other one, which involved a downgrade on a short domestic leg in India. It took almost an hour to re-ticket the original now spanning three airlines United, Lufthansa and Air India. I got more than adequate Future Flight Credits to cover for the small downgrade.

Once that was done I got another SMS with a choice of three hotels to choose from in the Newark area complements of United including breakfast. I picked one and an e-document with reservation info appeared on my phone and I was on my way to the hotel, after picking up my checked bag from the belt. I chose a hotel that had their shuttle operating at what by then was 2am, but had I used a taxi, I was told to submit the receipt for reimbursement.

It was one of the better IRROPS handling experience I had as it did not involve standing in that mile long line at a Service Desk. I didn't know if my lifetime status had anything to do with the extraordinarily good handling or not.

The next day when I showed up at the airport for the 5pm departure to Munich, United checked me through all the way to Kolkata involving three airlines. All the inter-airline transfers went flawlessly and miraculously my bag traveled with me with correct interline transfers all the way!

Amtrak should, for one thing, develop relationships with one or more airlines to be able to offer alternatives involving air transport when in a jam. Usually it does manage to handle misconnects in Chicago well. It should attempt to deploy the same acumen for handling IRROPS across the board, involving foreign (i.e. air or road) carriers where it makes sense. They used to do much more of that in the past.

In the removal of a Sleeper scenario I would expect to get an SMS and/or email as soon as the change is known, with instructions of what to do, and possibly even an alternative or two to choose from and approve and take it from there. But that would require an extremely functional IT platform.
 
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AA and DL automatically update you and reschedule or reroute you right there in the app. I'm sure UA is the same but it's been a while. It just amazes me how airlines could start with a system very similar to Amtrak and be this far ahead while Amtrak seems to be going backward somehow. It's just nuts.
 
AA and DL automatically update you and reschedule or reroute you right there in the app. I'm sure UA is the same but it's been a while. It just amazes me how airlines could start with a system very similar to Amtrak and be this far ahead while Amtrak seems to be going backward somehow. It's just nuts.
I agree.

UA does auto handling if the reroute is in house, but consults when it involves re-ticketing involving different airlines and potential downgrades, which is what happened in my case. What was a United and Vistara itinerary became a United, Lufthansa and Air India one. BTW the other one involved Emirates, which surprised me, but I just learned that Emirates and United are about to announce a large code share agreement on the 14th of Sept!

The legacy CRSs are all derived from the original two or so, including Amtrak's. But architecturally they have evolved very differently. But that is a matter for another thread.Perhaps we need a thread on the evolution of CRSs. I attempted to seed one, but it went nowhere.
 
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AA and DL automatically update you and reschedule or reroute you right there in the app. I'm sure UA is the same but it's been a while. It just amazes me how airlines could start with a system very similar to Amtrak and be this far ahead while Amtrak seems to be going backward somehow. It's just nuts.

UA, in my limited experience, does very well with rerouting on its own metal. I don't know the exact metric or back-end process, but once a delay is triggered, the app will automatically give a plethora of options for rerouting even for a relatively short delay. I think Delta is similar in that respect. AA, when I had a missed connection, rebooked me on a flight the next day without any obvious option for other rebooking, so I had to visit a counter in that instance. They wouldn't place me on another airline, but I was able to get home that same day with an extra connection and some points to make up for it.

Amtrak's system is woeful in comparison. I don't know if Amtrak auto-rebooks connections if one is missed between a LD train and a Northeast Regional, but it seems reasonable to expect that Amtrak could just do this without a visit to the ticket counter. Ideally a rebooking menu should pop up in the app or website and allow passengers to select their preferred time (maybe they'd rather have a 2-3 hour layover to grab supper after the delay rather than immediately run to the next train.) Offering reasonable self-service options helps everyone - the passenger feels more in control, it saves on labor costs, and (at least in my opinion) makes me feel better about choosing that particular company and may make me want to book with them again because I know they'll handle things decently well.
 
A couple days ago I saw a photo of the California Zephyr somewhere in the mountains, leaving Denver I believe it said. It was on a curve by a river and you could make out the whole consist. It was made up of the new double equipment but early in its use I would guess. Anyway with all this discussion of canceled sleepers and removal of diners and being often sold out, I was surprised to be able to count 14 superliner cars making up the train. I don't know when they started all these cut backs and lack of help, but something is wrong that a popular train like that can be neglected so far as cars and conditions.
 
It was made up of the new double equipment but early in its use I would guess.
There ain't no such thing. No new believels have come into service since the Surfliners.

There may have been deadheads of various types, possibly including bilevel California Cars being repatriated from Beech Grove.

A picture would help. I think an absolute max revenue consist would have been, baggage, 3 sleepers (or transdorm and two sleepers), diner, Sightseer, two coaches. 8 cars max in the active consist. Small chance of 3 coaches, making an active consist of 9.
 
A couple days ago I saw a photo of the California Zephyr somewhere in the mountains, leaving Denver I believe it said. It was on a curve by a river and you could make out the whole consist. It was made up of the new double equipment but early in its use I would guess. Anyway with all this discussion of canceled sleepers and removal of diners and being often sold out, I was surprised to be able to count 14 superliner cars making up the train. I don't know when they started all these cut backs and lack of help, but something is wrong that a popular train like that can be neglected so far as cars and conditions.

This is likely a picture from before the Desert Wind and Pioneer were cancelled.

The usual consist in those times was transdorm, 2 Oakland sleepers, diner, lounge, 2 Oakland coaches, Seattle sleeper, Seattle coach, Los Angeles sleeper, Los Angeles coach, and some times a Los Angeles diner (11 or 12 bilevels) - 14 would be unusual even back then, unless you count the single level baggage cars, but I can imagine a 3rd Oakland coach or a 2nd Los Angeles coach.

The "equipment shortage" sob story for western trains started in the early 90s, when the Superliner II order was not big enough to reequip CONO, CL, and Auto-Train and the western trains got robbed, and got worse when the ATSF Hi-Levels were retired (the transdorm and the Los Angeles diner, and oftentimes 1 or 2 of the coaches, were Hi-Levels and not Superliners).

But even back then, the sleepers were expensive, and sold out every trip all summer, and we bemoaned Amtrak not having bought enough equipment to meet the demand.
 
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