WiFi on longer routes

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United Airlines just struck a deal with Starlink to provide terrestrial quality WiFi on flights at no cost to the passengers starting 2025.

https://apnews.com/article/united-a...nternet-wifi-088d76af3fcca0b9108ced8b2ee19470

Allegedly one would be able to stream stuff to one's heart's content, something that you can;t quite do at present.

On terrestrial service like Amtrak a combination of terrestrial cellular and Starlink would be needed for best result since trains go through places where satellite visibility is minimal to non-existent. But for most of the route of a train like the EB across the high plains Starlink would work wonders. I hope Amtrak considers this possibility.

I know Indian Railways provides WiFi via Satellite Link, specifically select trains like Howrah Rajdhani. I suspect the connection just drops when it passes through three short tunnels that the train via Grand Chord passes through. There will be issues like that in almost every train in the US. Hence the need for providing blended carrier service.
 
jis said:
Allegedly one would be able to stream stuff to one's heart's content, something that you can;t quite do at present.
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Delta deployed streaming grade Internet domestically in February 2023. European and South American deployment is in progress with Africa scheduled this winter and Asia next year. Latency is obviously a factor but I was able to stream and download videos without much issue.
 
jis said:
On terrestrial service like Amtrak a combination of terrestrial cellular and Starlink would be needed for best result since trains go through places where satellite visibility is minimal to non-existent. But for most of the route of a train like the EB across the high plains Starlink would work wonders. I hope Amtrak considers this possibility.
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I think for the long-distance routes (CZ, EB, Silver services) "no internet in tunnels" would be a pretty good compromise.

Starlink works pretty well on Brightline, although that's not exactly a route with many tunnels.
 
bonzoesc said:
I think for the long-distance routes (CZ, EB, Silver services) "no internet in tunnels" would be a pretty good compromise.

Starlink works pretty well on Brightline, although that's not exactly a route with many tunnels.
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Probably only stations that have overhead canopy's? Such as MCO.
 
For the folks out there with mobile carriers that charge "roaming" fees/charges be careful. You may get a shocked on your bill. Years ago I didn't realize my phone was in roaming and uploading all the pictures to wherever the cloud is. Also 35mm digital camera with a wi-fi card was too. Folllowing month got my Sprint bill for $650.00. Luckily they worked with me and cut it in half. I did take 100's of pics in full resolution.
 
My wife needed to be on a conference call while she was on the train, timing was just bad as normally it could wait till she arrived.

Anyway, a neighbor of mine is a regional engineer for T-Mobile.

He suggested a setup to give us the best chance of good coverage and speeds.

A GL-iNet GL-X3000 paired with a Waveform Quad Mini external antenna.

We had service the entire ride from Winter Park to NY and speeds were decent to excellent, ranging from 8-50Mbps down and 2-30Mbps up.

My wife was able to have her conference call and we even streamed some YouTube TV.

Now it came at a high price over $600 for all the equipment, so probably not worth it depending on use case. In our case, my neighbor lent us his equipment, so we didn't have to pay for it, I am not sure what we would have done had we had to pay for it ourselves.
 
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Devil's Advocate said:
I remember AT&T (Cingular) charging me over $300/mo for hometown data to use the first iPhone on EDGE (2G). I don't think domestic roaming is still an issue with flat rate post paid plans, but if you travel internationally without a global plan you can enable WiFi calling and disable chargeable roaming.
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I got nailed for Verizon international day charge as I slept near El Paso on the SL/TE. At some point we were a few hundred yards on the US side of the border, and my phone was asleep the entire time so I place no calls, sent no messages and did no web browsing through a Mexican cell tower. So if you have an international service, be sure to explicitly disable it before getting close to the border. (The charge seemed to have kicked in an hour or two east of El Paso while I was still asleep and the train was much farther from the border than we were in El Paso itself (west bound), so probably it's a good idea to disable it the night before at bed time.)
 
John Santos said:
I got nailed for Verizon international day charge as I slept near El Paso on the SL/TE. At some point we were a few hundred yards on the US side of the border, and my phone was asleep the entire time so I place no calls, sent no messages and did no web browsing through a Mexican cell tower. So if you have an international service, be sure to explicitly disable it before getting close to the border. (The charge seemed to have kicked in an hour or two east of El Paso while I was still asleep and the train was much farther from the border than we were in El Paso itself (west bound), so probably it's a good idea to disable it the night before at bed time.)
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With most of the providers on their newer plans roaming in Mexico and Canada is included, so no extra roaming charges.

Older plans generally did not include roaming in Mexico and Canada.
 
John Santos said:
I got nailed for Verizon international day charge as I slept near El Paso on the SL/TE. At some point we were a few hundred yards on the US side of the border, and my phone was asleep the entire time so I place no calls, sent no messages and did no web browsing through a Mexican cell tower. So if you have an international service, be sure to explicitly disable it before getting close to the border. (The charge seemed to have kicked in an hour or two east of El Paso while I was still asleep and the train was much farther from the border than we were in El Paso itself (west bound), so probably it's a good idea to disable it the night before at bed time.)
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I had this happen to me years ago when Sprint was still around. I explained I was on the train and they dropped my roaming charges. Not sure if Verizon would do the same for you.
 
eackly said:
My wife needed to be on a conference call while she was on the train, timing was just bad as normally it could wait till she arrived.

Anyway, a neighbor of mine is a regional engineer for T-Mobile.

He suggested a setup to give us the best chance of good coverage and speeds.

A GL-iNet GL-X3000 paired with a Waveform Quad Mini external antenna.

We had service the entire ride from Winter Park to NY and speeds were decent to excellent, ranging from 8-50Mbps down and 2-30Mbps up.

My wife was able to have her conference call and we even streamed some YouTube TV.

Now it came at a high price over $600 for all the equipment, so probably not worth it depending on use case. In our case, my neighbor lent us his equipment, so we didn't have to pay for it, I am not sure what we would have done had we had to pay for it ourselves.
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I didn’t know that you could connect an external antenna or other device to a modern cell phone. Could you explain this further?🤔
 
Many passengers use their phone as a WiFi hotspot to their laptop. I always do this and have never used Amtrak WiFi. The $500 rig described is a cellular modem with WiFi plus a big cellular antenna than plugs into it. That plays the role of the phone. Additionally you can use its WiFi connection in your phone.

All these scenarios including Amtrak's rely on cell towers. Coverage maps of the three big networks show you might need two networks, but Androids are under $100 and you can just prepay monthly and stop anytime. (The coverage maps vary in their truthfullness.) I wouldn't count on roaming data. Google sells a phone that uses two networks, but as I recall it, not the third one. That would be Verizon, which has the most coverage over the U.S., and switches over for free to Rogers in Canada (and sometimes in Detroit!). Some areas just have no service, even on the East Coast, when away from highways and cities.

The idea that Amtrak's cellular WiFi can support a trainload of people when some are watching movies or playing high demand games is a no-go. There's no prioritization as far as I know. South Korea figured out cellular networks on underground public transit long ago, with many riders watching movies on their phones, directly on cellular without WiFi. Amtrak cellular perhaps could work if it paid to use more modems, or charged customers for data.

Another scenario uses the new satellite services. These are on ships, airplanes and Brightline, and work at your house if you don't have too much tree cover. Jis I think mentioned trees could be a problem on a train.
 
That is an issue generally near borders and somewhat unavoidable. I have had my phone switch to a Canadian tower at Many Glacier in Glacier NP which is many miles south of the border. Happily, my T-Mobile plan includes North American roaming.
 

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